The Dudeism Forum

Hey all, lurked for a while but decided that the Supreme Court has roundly rejected prior restraint, so here I am ready to add to this here rug, so to speak.

I'm early 30s, a shrink in NYC (clinical approach: just take it easy, man), and I'm married with a 2 yo with twins on the way (that's what I need my Johnson for, Donny).

So now we're a single income family in the most expensive area of the country and it has me thinking a lot about abiding and the dudely stance toward employment. I like to think I hit the balance pretty well between "fuck it" and responsible, and I'm fine stepping up and working my ass off when my family grows, and it doesn't hurt that I truly enjoy my job helping others find ways to abide, take it easy, and be ok with who they are.

But regarding the movie, much is made of the Dudes unemployment. I know that in an early draft he was an heir to the rubics cube fortune, and the Dudely Lama and I once had an exchange and agreed on Facebook that that would have significantly reduced our respect for his lifestyle of simplicity and non-attachment if he was just a trustifarian. But now that I think about it, why?

What kind of unemployment makes the Dude's admirable or noble? For instance, would it rub some the wrong way if he was faking disability and sponging off the government? Or what if he dealt Thai sticks and was just a burnout drug dealer? I think the Coens were brilliant in leaving that question open bc we can give whatever our most generous interpretation of his lifestyle we want to.

But we can't pretend that the dude was monastically meh about money. Most of his maneuverings in the plot are to secure more and more money from everyone involved, even worrying about his taxes, and being willing to mislead others to get more money.

I don't know if there's a specific question in here. More just a launch pad maybe for a convo about money, what is worth sacrificing to get it, and what kind of disbelief we need to suspend to take as plausible an unemployed man with a Venice bungalow, plenty of Js, and a full bar of expensive liquor.

Lots of thoughts in this duders head apparently. Looking forward to conversing...

I have the very same thoughts. It's easy being the dude when you really don't worry about money that much, and this lifestyle poorly applies to our everyday lives, especially to those with families to maintain. The best thing one can do in this situation is to try and take it easy without saying 'fuck it', because you can't really do it when you got people you hold responsibility for.

It's really nice to see a shrink looking to the Dude's way of life. Speaking of the subject, I have two questions:
Do you use any aspects of dudeism in your job? As in, try to lead your clients to some of the Dude's ways?
And is 'shrink' an offensive way of addressing a psychiatrist? English is not my native language and I thought this word was a tad offensive, which is why I was surprised to see you use it on yourself.

The aspects of Dudeism I use in both my office job and in my role as an interfaith minister/chaplain would involve letting go and just being and trying not to be a Walter when life happens. It takes a decided effort to do this sometimes but if I can do it by example I can help others do it too.
As far as money goes... for me it's about realizing I don't need a lot of material things to be truly happy - and a good vacation for me is best good spent locally and spending less. I don't mind the odd overnight stay someplace but it isn't necessary...

I always thought that he must be collecting some sort of an annuity. The idea of an inheritance never crossed my mind. Now, it always bother me to think that a unemployed "bum" lived in LA without any means to income. "Bums" that have no income in LA live out on the streets. Second, it is never mention that he has no money. The way he choses to live his life detached from unnecessary luxuries is a different story. Perhaps he is a very methodical cheap skate that knows how to maintain and reserve his limited income... oh fuck it! He is just the man for his time and place...
Moreover, one can find balance paying the bills and rasing a family in the professional world and still abide, I believe. One just needs to know when to take it easy and not let the stress take over one's own Walter. Sounds silly but what helps me is to ask the famous cheesy question when a job related stressful situation arises: "What would the DUDE do?"
Peace out
 

Welcome to the forum PriorRestraint. I've too thought about this in depth at times, especially when keeping my mind limber... how is the Dude maintaining his fuck it lifestyle yet still having enough clams to do so? There are a lot of uh, possible facets to this I believe, but my main idea as to how he does it is I think he's collecting royalties for his past "works" like the Port Huron statement, or maybe he pulled his back out hauling gear for the bunch of assholes that is Metallica and they're paying him disability... If he truly was permanently crip- uh,handicapped- disabled and couldn't work I wouldn't have a problem with this, but if he was "working the system" that'd be very UnDude. Perhaps he simply did okay in the early stages of his career and lived cheap(and continues to do so) saved his money, and draws it out as needed. One can only speculate...
Man, lotta ins, lotta outs here, lotta what have yous...
Certainly too many strands to keep straight in this Duder's head man.

It's always possible that he worked his ass off, has millions, and is living off the interest and investments. Some famous athletes put their big money into their own trust fund and live off that.

That could explain why he's so laid back. He might have had an epiphany or breakdown and realized he was happier not being in the rat race.

Glad to see this post sparked a little more conversation.

I sometimes use 'shrink' to apply to my job when talking to non-professionals because it seems snooty to refer to myself as a clinical psychologist (PhDude?), and frankly there are some aspects of the job, and people who do it, who deserve some ribbing or are total reactionaries who need to take themselves less seriously.

I often find myself advocating for an abiding frame of mind and a take it easier perspective, especially working as much as I do with type A, perfectionist achievers in NYC. After all most of the dude's methods -- stay closely connected to friends, know your personal methods to best re center yourself and practice them often, don't compare yourself to others who have more/better, etc -- have long been known to make people happier and less stressed.

In terms of the $$ issue, a recent "__ facts the dude would abide" article i saw on FB again stated the rubic's cube original story but said that it was Joel who decided to drop that and leave it unaddressed. I think that conscious omission must therefore be important but I'm not sure how exactly other than maybe any of the possible alternatives (heir, freeloader, etc) would distract viewers from his dudely ways in the present and maybe turn off some people (I'd probably respect his lifestyle less if he'd just inherited his money as was a trustifarian for example).

And bullettooth I really like the thread you started on balance and abiding. This has gotten too long but I'll reply to it when I've given it more thought.

no, not really. he told Maude about his life in short after they had sex, and he pretty much was like that all his life.
even without that scene, I don't think it would be logical to assume he suddenly switched to this way of life. Even if you somehow quit the material world after getting rich, it does things to your conscience and character. And you certainly don't go to another house to ask for a rug.

Quote from: Masked Dude on August 17, 2013, 11:18:21 AM
It's always possible that he worked his ass off, has millions, and is living off the interest and investments.

I imagine lots of perfectionists suffer from self-criticizing issues?
P.S. please stop me if I'm digging too deep here, I respect the doctor-patient confidentiality, just asking in general out of curiosity.

Quote from: PriorRestraint on August 17, 2013, 01:50:51 PM
Glad to see this post sparked a little more conversation.

I sometimes use 'shrink' to apply to my job when talking to non-professionals because it seems snooty to refer to myself as a clinical psychologist (PhDude?), and frankly there are some aspects of the job, and people who do it, who deserve some ribbing or are total reactionaries who need to take themselves less seriously.

I often find myself advocating for an abiding frame of mind and a take it easier perspective, especially working as much as I do with type A, perfectionist achievers in NYC. After all most of the dude's methods -- stay closely connected to friends, know your personal methods to best re center yourself and practice them often, don't compare yourself to others who have more/better, etc -- have long been known to make people happier and less stressed.

In terms of the $$ issue, a recent "__ facts the dude would abide" article i saw on FB again stated the rubic's cube original story but said that it was Joel who decided to drop that and leave it unaddressed. I think that conscious omission must therefore be important but I'm not sure how exactly other than maybe any of the possible alternatives (heir, freeloader, etc) would distract viewers from his dudely ways in the present and maybe turn off some people (I'd probably respect his lifestyle less if he'd just inherited his money as was a trustifarian for example).

And bullettooth I really like the thread you started on balance and abiding. This has gotten too long but I'll reply to it when I've given it more thought.

Quote from: Bullett00th on August 19, 2013, 06:45:42 AM
I imagine lots of perfectionists suffer from self-criticizing issues?

That must be exhausting...

Quote from: Havazhyol on August 19, 2013, 07:55:24 AM

Quote from: Bullett00th on August 19, 2013, 06:45:42 AM
I imagine lots of perfectionists suffer from self-criticizing issues?

That must be exhausting...

It really is. When you are raised with certain standards which you later realize you don't need in life, it's borderline impossible to just kick them out of your mind.

I know, I dropped most of those which made me mentaly suffocate like 5 or 6 years ago. All the hypocrite politness, all teh seeds of "fear and follow what is told you", impregnanted by our so called "well-minded" society.

It's been 5 to 6 years that I send my first, honnest, and fully thought outloud "Aw, fuck it" (in french, "Et puis merde."), since then, I think by myself, for myself, without injuring others about my way of thinking, which made them somekind of jealous, hence irritated by me.

So yes, you can trust me, it's exhausting (especcially the other folks).

I just found a perfect place to quote the Dude  .

Cheers folks.

Quote from: Havazhyol on August 19, 2013, 07:55:24 AM

Quote from: Bullett00th on August 19, 2013, 06:45:42 AM
I imagine lots of perfectionists suffer from self-criticizing issues?

That must be exhausting...

Warning: TL;DR post, sorry!

Yeah I would say that perfectionism requires self-critical thoughts, but perfectionism is just one way that self-critical thoughts can manifest. And you're right, those thoughts are exhausting, for the person but also for their friends, families, and co-workers (nothing worse than a perfectionistic boss).

I think TBL has something meaningful to contribute here. If we think about the limo scene, the Dude admits that he had been down in the dumps earlier that morning because he'd lost some money. But he didn't handle that disappointment by quitting the whole case, or by pushing harder and harder to control the outcome. No, he abided, meaning that he kept doing what he does: bowl, steal moments to enjoy and chill himself out, but he also kept plugging along at the case until new shit came to light. And before you know it, he's able to happily shrug it all off with I can't worry about that shit, life goes on, man. Because life brings new shit to light so constantly and predictably that it's too exhausting to label each moment as good or bad, and you end up just going with the flow.

I think that that abiding requires the perspective of Life goes on, that there's always new developments and strikes and gutters to come. Mix that long view with a take it easy MO that resists getting panicked and anxious, and you can relax until that point where most problems resolve themselves over time.

Because if you think about it, self-critical thoughts operate from a different world view, one where each task/moment/interaction is a test that you can fail, which if true would make it reasonable for one to be stressed, pressured, and racked with guilt, or if you happen not to fail, inflated ego.

But a moment's reflection on life exposes the lie of this. Life isn't a series of pass/fail tests. We shoot for an overall positive average, and we surround ourselves with people who grade us on a curve because they like or love us. A couple of rude comments and a "They're going to cut your dick off, Larry" didn't cause the dude to wallow in self-criticism. Life went on, and overall things worked out and he kept his dudely average.

Quote from: PriorRestraint on August 19, 2013, 03:26:52 PM
I think that that abiding requires the perspective of Life goes on, that there's always new developments and strikes and gutters to come. Mix that long view with a take it easy MO that resists getting panicked and anxious, and you can relax until that point where most problems resolve themselves over time.

Because if you think about it, self-critical thoughts operate from a different world view, one where each task/moment/interaction is a test that you can fail, which if true would make it reasonable for one to be stressed, pressured, and racked with guilt, or if you happen not to fail, inflated ego.

But a moment's reflection on life exposes the lie of this. Life isn't a series of pass/fail tests. We shoot for an overall positive average, and we surround ourselves with people who grade us on a curve because they like or love us. A couple of rude comments and a "They're going to cut your dick off, Larry" didn't cause the dude to wallow in self-criticism. Life went on, and overall things worked out and he kept his dudely average.

this is pretty much spot on!

only thing is, realizing this and actually living with this thought as your way of life are different things. the latter isn't easy, but at least we have to try and aim for this way of thinking