The Dudeism Forum

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ejQyPFDUUg

Quote from: BikerDude on February 26, 2013, 05:20:11 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ejQyPFDUUg

Perhaps, but I would say that as long as people are religious it will never seem outdated. That's just like my opinion, man.

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 02:27:36 AM

Quote from: BikerDude on February 26, 2013, 05:20:11 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ejQyPFDUUg

Perhaps, but I would say that as long as people are religious it will never seem outdated. That's just like my opinion, man.

So Zeus is still relevant.
Who knew.

I liked the part where Lawrence Krauss actually talked like a sane person.
"Of course religion is irrelevant. NO ONE believes most of the stuff that religion says. Even the religious."

The nun who "defends" religion does the typical thing of talking about stuff that, if quoted directly from scripture, would boil down to one side of a sheet of paper.
So the reality is that at this point even the religious throw out 99.99 percent of scripture.
And what is left is not in any way unique to religion.
And numbers of people who report being affiliated have plummeted. And among those who do "say" that they are a member of a religion at least a third don't practice and simply report themselves as members of the religion that their parents where.
It's just being propped up out of some sort of identity affiliation rather than relevance IMO.

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 02:27:36 AM
Perhaps, but I would say that as long as people are religious it will never seem outdated. That's just like my opinion, man.

And entitled to an opinion you are, Sir.

Mine: The time for superstition ended with The Enlightenment, which was too long in coming as it was. Religion in the classic sense serves no purpose in modern society except to keep the masses unreasonably subjugated. As long as the people have gods to petition and to blame, the rulers are not held responsible and accountable for their actions. Take the gods out of it, and the people will stop pleading with their gods to make life more bearable, and will instead demand it of their rulers. It might fuck up the cult of capitalism, but that's an outmoded idea whose time has passed, too. If our culture doesn't learn empathy soon, it's going to learn misery instead.

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 08:32:01 AM

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 02:27:36 AM
Perhaps, but I would say that as long as people are religious it will never seem outdated. That's just like my opinion, man.

And entitled to an opinion you are, Sir.

Mine: The time for superstition ended with The Enlightenment, which was too long in coming as it was. Religion in the classic sense serves no purpose in modern society except to keep the masses unreasonably subjugated. As long as the people have gods to petition and to blame, the rulers are not held responsible and accountable for their actions. Take the gods out of it, and the people will stop pleading with their gods to make life more bearable, and will instead demand it of their rulers. It might fuck up the cult of capitalism, but that's an outmoded idea whose time has passed, too. If our culture doesn't learn empathy soon, it's going to learn misery instead.

OK, but my question be; how do you define "religion?"

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 08:37:08 AM

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 08:32:01 AM

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 02:27:36 AM
Perhaps, but I would say that as long as people are religious it will never seem outdated. That's just like my opinion, man.

And entitled to an opinion you are, Sir.

Mine: The time for superstition ended with The Enlightenment, which was too long in coming as it was. Religion in the classic sense serves no purpose in modern society except to keep the masses unreasonably subjugated. As long as the people have gods to petition and to blame, the rulers are not held responsible and accountable for their actions. Take the gods out of it, and the people will stop pleading with their gods to make life more bearable, and will instead demand it of their rulers. It might fuck up the cult of capitalism, but that's an outmoded idea whose time has passed, too. If our culture doesn't learn empathy soon, it's going to learn misery instead.

OK, but my question be; how do you define "religion?"

That's a uniquely modern view.
I'm not aware of any religion that allows it's followers to pick and choose.
Religion does it's own defining. (I don't buy that Dudeism is a religion BTW)
We are really talking about the heavy hitters. They have their tenants. They define themselves.
A lot of people today will allow that they are "spiritual".
A religious person has a name for that. A heretic. The fact is religion has no allowance for that in fact they strictly disallow it. The name heretic has that meaning.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YLQ6TGRCl_s

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 08:32:01 AM


It might fuck up the cult of capitalism, but that's an outmoded idea whose time has passed, too. If our culture doesn't learn empathy soon, it's going to learn misery instead.

Yes some will.
Except the winners in the Capatalism rat race.
You can bet that the shit won't be hitting them any time soon.
Unless the peasants fling it that is.
They see it coming. A lot of what they are doing is preparing for that.
Nobody sees the writing on the wall more clearly than the "masters of the universe".
And they will be ready when the shit hits the fan.
It's a question of what eventually will replace capitalism and who will run it.
If history teaches anything it is that it will be something like fascism and it will be run by the capitalists.
Just like in the past. I mean no matter how you cut it that really is the inevitable end game and I would seriously point out that when you look at the beliefs of these people it is fueled by a christian belief in an active God.
They see themselves as "winning" because God wants it that way.
Really. I mean you need to get into the mindset of the very powerful wasp mentality.
It's just horrible. And in the end they believe that Jesus will be back to Judge and then nukes, fire, hell name it.
They aren't sitting on their hands. If it comes down to it they will take it all before giving up their stash.
Count on it. Some will do the shitting and some will get shit on. For the bible tells me so.
Most hard core capitalists see capitalism as God's plan. They hate socialism and communism because it fucks that up. To them some should suffer and some should not. Any effort to even that out is "Godless".
Every knee shall bend. To them Might literally does make right.

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 09:15:19 AM
They see it coming. A lot of what they are doing is preparing for that.
Nobody sees the writing on the wall more clearly than the "masters of the universe".

It's ironic that the end they see as near is one of their own making, and their own actions are the only thing making it inevitable. With the will to do it, the course could be corrected starting this afternoon. Without the will to do it the richies will be very severely fucked when the world they're creating is realized, and their wealth will not save them.

It is indeed a very interesting time to be alive.

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 09:58:33 AM

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 09:15:19 AM
They see it coming. A lot of what they are doing is preparing for that.
Nobody sees the writing on the wall more clearly than the "masters of the universe".

It's ironic that the end they see as near is one of their own making, and their own actions are the only thing making it inevitable. With the will to do it, the course could be corrected starting this afternoon. Without the will to do it the richies will be very severely fucked when the world they're creating is realized, and their wealth will not save them.

It is indeed a very interesting time to be alive.

Well if you believe the Christian fairy tail their wealth will save them.
And yes. They celebrate it. It's the coming of Jesus.
And remember the devout will be on board to help out.
Turn coat fucks that they are.

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 08:37:08 AM
OK, but my question be; how do you define "religion?"

My own perspective is that belief in invisible sentient beings who control the course of human events is religion. And Dudeism, and modern pantheism, and Zen, and secular humanism, and several other things that are often called religion but lack the invisible sentient beings are worldview rather than religion. Not that I'm anything like an authority on either religion or language. It's all I can do to string together an unambiguous sentence every few weeks or so.

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 10:02:57 AM
Well if you believe the Christian fairy tail their wealth will save them.

I've never been afflicted by that particular delusion. I gave it a fair shake once upon a time, read all of the western holey texts cover to cover and back to back in chronological order, all the way from an invisible space monster speaking light into existence to some random con man sticking his face into his hat and somehow proving that he wasn't just making shit up by failing to get the same story twice from the same golden tablet that's every bit as long lost as the stone upon which god his own fucking self scribbled some commandments. I was all of six or seven years old at the time but I knew bullshit when I saw it.

And then over on the other side of the spectrum at about the same magnitude of bat shit insanity there are some ostensibly bright guys who believe with every bit as much fervor that the salvation of the species will come by way of infesting far away worlds. Now there, my friend, is some fucked up hillbilly shit. We're going to tear up this trailer so bad that it's no longer fit for habitation, then pack up and move on, leaving behind a house full of garbage and rats, and a yard littered with derelict automobiles and dead appliances in which the feral cats we're abandoning might find shelter? And it's the best plan we can come up with? Somehow superior to demanding that the invisible space monster take us all in at his house in the sky where there's always pie (but never any fucking)?

Advanced civilization my ass. It's about time we all just stop what we're doing, smoke a doobie, and think our way through this shit (for the first time) rather than just frenetically running around hoping for a fucking miracle. We can do better than this. I don't hold out much hope for it, but I know we can if we choose to.

I'm like a child wandering in the middle of a movie here (because i can't be arsed to read the whole thread)
but in response to the original "is religion outdated?" i'd say it's not really outdated it's just continuing to evolve.
The more recent religions such as Dudeism are amogst the most advaced but spiritual paths such as buddhism and Daoism are highly adaptable and i'm sure will continue to find environmental niches.
Old shit like catholicism is pretty clunky but fits in fine in less evolved societies so will stay around for quite a while yet.
that's not just my opinion dude - that's the word of the Lord.

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 12:07:20 PM

Quote from: DigitalBuddha on February 27, 2013, 08:37:08 AM
OK, but my question be; how do you define "religion?"

My own perspective is that belief in invisible sentient beings who control the course of human events is religion. And Dudeism, and modern pantheism, and Zen, and secular humanism, and several other things that are often called religion but lack the invisible sentient beings are worldview rather than religion. Not that I'm anything like an authority on either religion or language. It's all I can do to string together an unambiguous sentence every few weeks or so.

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 10:02:57 AM
Well if you believe the Christian fairy tail their wealth will save them.

I've never been afflicted by that particular delusion. I gave it a fair shake once upon a time, read all of the western holey texts cover to cover and back to back in chronological order, all the way from an invisible space monster speaking light into existence to some random con man sticking his face into his hat and somehow proving that he wasn't just making shit up by failing to get the same story twice from the same golden tablet that's every bit as long lost as the stone upon which god his own fucking self scribbled some commandments. I was all of six or seven years old at the time but I knew bullshit when I saw it.

And then over on the other side of the spectrum at about the same magnitude of bat shit insanity there are some ostensibly bright guys who believe with every bit as much fervor that the salvation of the species will come by way of infesting far away worlds. Now there, my friend, is some fucked up hillbilly shit. We're going to tear up this trailer so bad that it's no longer fit for habitation, then pack up and move on, leaving behind a house full of garbage and rats, and a yard littered with derelict automobiles and dead appliances in which the feral cats we're abandoning might find shelter? And it's the best plan we can come up with? Somehow superior to demanding that the invisible space monster take us all in at his house in the sky where there's always pie (but never any fucking)?

Advanced civilization my ass. It's about time we all just stop what we're doing, smoke a doobie, and think our way through this shit (for the first time) rather than just frenetically running around hoping for a fucking miracle. We can do better than this. I don't hold out much hope for it, but I know we can if we choose to.

I worry a lot less about belief than the actions that those beliefs bring.
Christianity is very busy right now. You all know how I feel about dominionism.
That's one type of paraquat but the tree is full of fruit right now. A bumper crop.
People have this idea that it isn't going to matter unless Christ comes strolling across the sea.
Believe me they won't be waiting around. So it being true or not has nothing to do with it.
The shit will be coming down either way.
Here's a woman being possessed by the spirit of a dog. (Yeah I know it happens to my wife from time to time also)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pJmLVtwxeN8

BTW that's the same guy that blessed Sarah Palin after she was chosen as John McCain's running mate.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jl4HIc-yfgM

This one has 3 demons living in her stomach. Oh no sorry the witch doctor took one out so now 2.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5t3vIBe96WQ

Right now there is a guy within 10 feet of me who has a "third eye" drawn on his forehead.
Personally I'd say that, if his skills at writing requirements documents is any indication, his third eye needs some serious glasses. Coke bottles.

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 01:28:27 PM
I worry a lot less about belief than the actions that those beliefs bring.

As do I!

Those people are working their asses off to prove that I am correct in my belief that democracy cannot work with an electorate as numerous as that of the United States. A guy would have to be running really short on brainpower to believe it good and just and right that his rights and freedoms should be decided by people who honestly believe that some gutter slut got knocked up a couple thousand years ago and gave birth to a god. The same hypocritical fucks would shun a teenager down the street who got knocked up and tried to claim that she'd never even seen a dick before. But they tolerate a bunch of other dipshits who believe that some random con man stuck his face into his hat and read the words of that same god on golden tablets found on a continent that was not known to exist by those who inhabited the land where that alleged god lived -- and the proof that the con man wasn't lying came in the form of his reading the same tablet twice and getting two different stories. Not to be outdone, a failed hack of a science fiction writer came up with the notion that all of humankind's problems are caused by invisible space aliens who live inside our bodies and must be exorcised, and though we might think it odd we maintain that it's anyone's right to believe that goofy shit -- and still cast ballots.

Then we pretend that democracy is the only right way to live, despite the fact that most of us are so easily duped and so eager to do as we are told by those who pretend to speak on behalf of invisible beings who live in outer space. And who controls the most destructive military force in the history of mankind? Those who pretend to speak on behalf of invisible beings who live in outer space. Tell me that shit ain't wrong.

So is the 21st century a good point in history to abandon religion before it fucks us all in the ass? Oh hell yes.

Quote from: RighteousDude on February 27, 2013, 04:27:54 PM

Quote from: BikerDude on February 27, 2013, 01:28:27 PM
I worry a lot less about belief than the actions that those beliefs bring.

As do I!

Those people are working their asses off to prove that I am correct in my belief that democracy cannot work with an electorate as numerous as that of the United States. A guy would have to be running really short on brainpower to believe it good and just and right that his rights and freedoms should be decided by people who honestly believe that some gutter slut got knocked up a couple thousand years ago and gave birth to a god. The same hypocritical fucks would shun a teenager down the street who got knocked up and tried to claim that she'd never even seen a dick before. But they tolerate a bunch of other dipshits who believe that some random con man stuck his face into his hat and read the words of that same god on golden tablets found on a continent that was not known to exist by those who inhabited the land where that alleged god lived -- and the proof that the con man wasn't lying came in the form of his reading the same tablet twice and getting two different stories. Not to be outdone, a failed hack of a science fiction writer came up with the notion that all of humankind's problems are caused by invisible space aliens who live inside our bodies and must be exorcised, and though we might think it odd we maintain that it's anyone's right to believe that goofy shit -- and still cast ballots.

Then we pretend that democracy is the only right way to live, despite the fact that most of us are so easily duped and so eager to do as we are told by those who pretend to speak on behalf of invisible beings who live in outer space. And who controls the most destructive military force in the history of mankind? Those who pretend to speak on behalf of invisible beings who live in outer space. Tell me that shit ain't wrong.

So is the 21st century a good point in history to abandon religion before it fucks us all in the ass? Oh hell yes.

Well we differ there.
I think people have the right to self governance even if they are gonna fuck it up.
Freedom includes the right to be an ass and the right to call someone an ass under the same umbrella.
If our aim is to get rid of crap that makes us stupid then I'd assume that we aim toward a condition fit for democracy eventually?
I'm not down with that.
It just becomes intellectual fascism.
People can be as stupid as they want and others can call them that.
Change happens slowly but even more slow when encumbered by irrational beliefs.
Some will follow. Others will cling. That's how it goes.