Screenwriter/director of the big Lebowski pens scathing election thank you note.
http://www.rollingstone.com/movies/news/ethan-coen-pens-scathing-thank-you-note-after-trump-win-w450158
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/13/opinion/sunday/2016-election-thank-you-notes.html?_r=0
"Calmer than you are."
Johnson?
Early on I put a note on Gary Johnson's Facebook page. They were looking for a campaign slogan and I sort of borrowed one from Bernie Sanders. I told them they should use "Feel The Johnson". They did not reply.
There was something that I heard on the news, though. There was a panel discussion as to why Trump won the election and one of the panelists said that he thought that a candidate cannot go around ridiculing supporters of the opposition by calling them names like "a basket of deplorables" without having to pay a price at some point. I think that perhaps a number of people who supported Trump in their hearts but had not committed to the idea of actually going to the polls took sufficient offense at statements like that to the point that they were inspired to go to the polls and cast a vote.
The other thing though, and I think I came up with this independent of news media input, is that it seems like this was a vote of revulsion, not revolution. I think that many people were just turned off by those who make a career of governance, that there was just too much influence by a group of career political hacks for too long and they voted for the guy with the unfortunate hairdo as a way of telling the DC crowd that they're just not going to continue to vote for the same old shit over and over.
But who knows? I sure as shit don't, that's why I stayed home on election day. I'm surprised that Coen didn't mention us non-voters in his letter. I heard somewhere that non-voting was at an all time high in this election. That might have contributed to the eventual outcome, too.
I was talking with my special lady about elections and voting and what have you, and how not voting is the same as a vote for the other guy. In some ways, I think yes, as a wasted vote, or indeed the amount of wasted votes have swayed elections. Also, do you think non voters have a right to protest the outcome? I mean, if they didn't want a particular candidate to win, vote against them, instead of not bothering. I'm not sure, dudes.
My old Political Science professor always used to say; In a democracy, you have a right to vote, but you also have a right not to vote. This is known as "Voting by abstention". Also, being in a democracy means that whether you vote or not, your voice has a right to be heard by those in power. Do you remove a persons right to voice an opinion about those in power just because they voted against those in power?
He also used to have us debate the issue of voting for the LOA (Least Objectionable Alternative) candidate(s). How many policies do you have to disagree with before you decide not to vote for the LOA? How far do you compromise your own ideologies in order to stop a candidate you disagree with in totality?
Of course, Voting By Abstention is much easier and carries more weight (in popular opinion) when your country's voting system has the option on the ballot papers for "None Of The Above".
Also, in addendum, we, as voters (in general) should never forget that democracy does not begin and end at the ballot box. Democracy means voicing our views and needs at every opportunity. Those who lead our nations are not our rulers, they are the highest servants of the people and must (or, rather, should) do what is best for the whole of the people, not just for those that voted for them (although they regularly do not).
Just a bunch of points to think about and debate. ;-)
I'd like to know what difference does voting by abstention make? How, by not voting, are changes made?
I think there should be an option to call for a vote of no confidence as a right, whether there is an election or not and if there are enough "none of the above" votes, what then? Would, (in the case of the recent election), the majority go to the next candidate? (Sanders). Lotta ins, Lotta outs, man!
Wiser people than myself would be able to give greater detail to the ins and outs of VbA.
My personal opinion is that the difference is more relevant to the individual than to the whole. Some people value their principles more than they do tactical voting (which is what happens if you vote for the LOA candidate). Some people simply believe that they cannot, in good conscience vote for people that go against their principle values.
Quote from: Dudeist Monk on November 17, 2016, 04:35:28 PM
Wiser people than myself would be able to give greater detail to the ins and outs of VbA.
My personal opinion is that the difference is more relevant to the individual than to the whole. Some people value their principles more than they do tactical voting (which is what happens if you vote for the LOA candidate). Some people simply believe that they cannot, in good conscience vote for people that go against their principle values.
I agree.
I have stopped felling obliged to pick one of the several hairballs the system hacks up every several years.
Our involvement should come before the next election to see to it that the monopoly that the two major parties have on ballot access and the debates etc is broken. If we have any hope for a candidate that isn't going to just hire their own guys from wall street when they get in we will need to build from bottom up.
Don't blame third-party voters. Blame Clinton for being an utterly deficient human being, and blame the DNC for allowing a career criminal to run for public office under their banner. Anybody except Clinton would have won the election for the Democrats handily. Clinton is the most corrupt and bloodthirsty politician in US history. Thank goodness that Trump prevented her from holding public office again.
Clinton had a very negative set of audit findings from the Office of the Inspector General regarding her complete lack of compliance with federal records requirements while Secretary of State. Since generating and properly storing federal records was basically her entire job, that report was nothing less than a finding that Clinton's performance as SoS was completely deficient. Such findings would normally be enough to end anybody's career, and it appears to have ended Hillary Clinton's exactly as we on the anti-Clinton side expected.
We on the anti-Clinton side are enjoying your salty tears, assorted cucks. Maybe demand better candidates from your political parties in the future.
They had a better candidate, but I guess the best interests of the people don't matter as much as which shitgibbon won! (At least Clinton has experience).
If you want change, petition for it, lobby it, vote for a better system, vote for the people you actually want in congress, not pipe up when it's too Late. Anything is better than the unpopularity contest held recently.
Tone it down, Sagebrush.
What is it about politics that brings out such rude behavior in people, even Dudeists?
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OK, so it's a common thing to see people get their dander up about elections, and vent some piss about it, and I think that this is sometimes healthy as long as we don't go too Walter on everyone standing around us. Looks to me that freedom of speech has been upheld in this a here thread (For your information, the Supreme Court has roundly rejected prior restraint), and opinions have been tendered. Having said that, let's say fuck it, get us a lane and roll a few. After that; a few burgers, a few beers, and we're back to being dude like, and we avoid a bar fight.
Personally, I see value in all opinions and respect the same, but remember; that's just like your opinion, man. :)
Abide in dudely wisdom, fellow dudes. Peace.
I went to church with the family for a Thanksgiving potluck and talent show tonight. Been a long time since I've done that. I needed to get the poison out of my soul from following the investigation into the Clintons.
I'm done with this topic. It appears that the matters that I was concerned about will be resolved in a few months' time. These paid riots and the rampant harassment and death threats against the electoral college electors seem to be the best that the establishment has to throw at us now. It will not work. They will all soon rot in jail for the horrifying things that we learned about from the crowdsourced investigation into the Wikileaks and related sources, and good riddance to them.
This is lunacy.
How do people go so far out on the thin ice of sanity?
Round the clock infowars?
Quote from: Brother D on November 17, 2016, 06:26:53 AM
Also, do you think non voters have a right to protest the outcome? I mean, if they didn't want a particular candidate to win, vote against them, instead of not bothering. I'm not sure, dudes.
George Carlin once theorized that those who have become so disgusted with the machine and refuse to hold their nose(s) and go to the polling place are merely innocent bystanders. People who vote for the eventual winner have no right to complain because once that person takes office and fucks everything up royally are actually his or her accomplices.
I tend to abide with this view.
As far as protesting, getting out in the street and carrying a sign, I have less than adequate interest but as far as bitching about what they do once they take the reins, well, if I'm paying taxes then I'm bitchin'.
That being said let us not forget that the actual results of the Electoral College scam are not completed and announced until December 19th or thereabouts and there is a movement afoot within that group to cast ballots for someone other than Trump because "he is not fit to hold the office". So nothing is fucked, dudes (for those who don't like Trump). My concern if that actually comes to fruition is that the entire country will be thrown into violent chaos and once that happens it might not be long until we are forced to resort to cannibalism. I'm starting to stock up on emergency supplies and ammo now. There is a You Tube vid of Tucker Carlson interviewing two of the electors who have been instrumental in getting this idea off the ground. It's gonna make for some damn good television but aside from that it scares the shit out of me.
I HAVE AN ACCOUNTING DEGREE! I know how to evaluate claims and evidence. You do not want to know what these bastards have been up to.
Trump is in.
The electoral college is a formality.
Any other outcome would be disastrous.
The fact that we have stooped so low that we have elected Donald Trump is bad enough without tearing the temple down in the process.
It's sad that after all the talk about Trump not accepting the results of the election it's the left unwilling to abide.
It made no difference one way or the other anyway.
Trump is the same. Any hints to the contrary is a show. His specialty.
Worst case scenario the rampant appetite for destruction that put him in office is used to prevent the possibility for a genuine candidate next time around. That will be the final irony.
His picks to run the fed are 2 Goldman Sacs alumni and Jamie Dimon the poster child for everything corrupt on wall street. Yes he changed his mind on that at least.
http://www.cnbc.com/2016/11/18/trump-courts-jpmorgan-ceo-jamie-dimon-for-treasury-post-heres-the-possible-successors.html
Meet the new boss. Same as the old boss.
Get over it. You had no choice. The system is not going to deliver anyone who is going to tear down the system.
He said what the predictably angry crowds wanted to hear.
He will simply illustrate how fucked we are to cheering crowds who are too stupid to know that they are witnessing their own disembowelment.
Well not for a decade at least.
Quote from: LotsaBadKarma on November 21, 2016, 01:08:38 PM
Quote from: Brother D on November 17, 2016, 06:26:53 AM
Also, do you think non voters have a right to protest the outcome? I mean, if they didn't want a particular candidate to win, vote against them, instead of not bothering. I'm not sure, dudes.
George Carlin once theorized that those who have become so disgusted with the machine and refuse to hold their nose(s) and go to the polling place are merely innocent bystanders. People who vote for the eventual winner have no right to complain because once that person takes office and fucks everything up royally are actually his or her accomplices.
I tend to abide with this view.
As far as protesting, getting out in the street and carrying a sign, I have less than adequate interest but as far as bitching about what they do once they take the reins, well, if I'm paying taxes then I'm bitchin'.
That being said let us not forget that the actual results of the Electoral College scam are not completed and announced until December 19th or thereabouts and there is a movement afoot within that group to cast ballots for someone other than Trump because "he is not fit to hold the office". So nothing is fucked, dudes (for those who don't like Trump). My concern if that actually comes to fruition is that the entire country will be thrown into violent chaos and once that happens it might not be long until we are forced to resort to cannibalism. I'm starting to stock up on emergency supplies and ammo now. There is a You Tube vid of Tucker Carlson interviewing two of the electors who have been instrumental in getting this idea off the ground. It's gonna make for some damn good television but aside from that it scares the shit out of me.
Finally, we agree on something! Yes, the electoral college votes will not be tampered with enough to affect the outcome, no matter how many cars are burned and shops are looted in the riots, and no matter how many Trump supporters are beaten to death in the streets. Maybe Trump was lying about prosecuting the people we're worried about. That's fine. We have it from the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff that Clinton's Syria no-fly zone would have resulted in war with Russia, and that war has been averted. If a bunch of very sick people go without prosecution, but war is averted, that is fine.
Quote from: SagebrushSage on November 21, 2016, 01:54:43 PM
Finally, we agree on something! Yes, the electoral college votes will not be tampered with enough to affect the outcome, no matter how many cars are burned and shops are looted in the riots, and no matter how many Trump supporters are beaten to death in the streets. Maybe Trump was lying about prosecuting the people we're worried about. That's fine. We have it from the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff that Clinton's Syria no-fly zone would have resulted in war with Russia, and that war has been averted. If a bunch of very sick people go without prosecution, but war is averted, that is fine.
I don't know about agree. On occasion you emerge from your general smog of paranoia and lunacy to a point that we seem to occupied the same dimension. But agree? I doubt it.
Averting war is fine but why does that need to go to praise and pandering of Putin?
I still think that he and his cohorts are the closest thing there is to the old "evil empire". Which was genuinely evil and is now comfortably I bed with the "alt right"
"So his toe slipped over the line a little, it's just a game man".
Agreed, that war was (hopefully) averted at the cost if something else.
I also don't think it's about tearing down the temple, it's about using it for what it's really for, with people of honour, integrity and the best interests of all, foreign and domestic.
I say patience. Wait and see what happens before Trump is sworn in to office.
(PS, for what it's worth, I hope the prospective attorney general doesn't mess with the current weed situation. I mean, that'd be a real bummer, mang! But hey, this is just like my opinion, man).
I will add though, with the current rise of alt/far right fascists, nwo, conservatives, etc, it's going backwards real fast. All the good work from liberal, peaceful people in the past few decades, is getting shot down in flames and it really bums me out dudes. I know that it'll affect all of us, but shit man, what a waste.
Oh well, better put my feet up, smoke a bowl and stop complaining. Who's roll is it?????
It took this election to make Glen Beck sound rational.
That and his no longer being beholden to the Republican party via fox
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rSIGuda79vg
Quote from: Brother D on November 21, 2016, 02:14:06 PM
I also don't think it's about tearing down the temple, it's about using it for what it's really for, with people of honour, integrity and the best interests of all, foreign and domestic.
I say patience. Wait and see what happens before Trump is sworn in to office.
(PS, for what it's worth, I hope the prospective attorney general doesn't mess with the current weed situation. I mean, that'd be a real bummer, mang! But hey, this is just like my opinion,
If the electoral college were to give the election to Hillary you will see domestic terrorism on a scale beyond anything ever seen. Y'all Queda will burn down the temple, the capital, the white house and every Starbucks from sea to shining sea. Trump was endorsed by every white power hate group that exists. And they probably started a few new ones.
Weed?
Rudy is a supercharged prick. Do the math.
I guess we'll never find out, thankfully. That does not excuse the actions of the militant liberals.
Here, don't believe me or the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs regarding Clinton's intention to risk nuclear war? Believe Rep. Tulsi Gabbard, D-HI. She speaks of the matter in her report of meeting with President-elect Trump.
I am a progressive in Gabbard's vein, not a "Y'all Queda" conservative. I oppose the Democrat party because they have used our values as a Trojan horse to bring about corruption and war profiteering. True progressives like Gabbard are those who will restore the legitimacy of progressive ideals such as environmentalism and democratic socialism. I am also fine with environmentally-conscious libertarianism, if that is what the people choose. Unless the corrupt wolves in sheeps' clothing who have hijacked the progressive movement are overthrown, we will never actually accomplish our aims for society.
http://gabbard.house.gov/index.php/press-releases/655-gabbard-statement-on-meeting-with-president-elect-donald-trump
Quote from: SagebrushSage on November 21, 2016, 06:48:08 PM
Here, don't believe me or the Chairman of the Joint Chiefs regarding Clinton's intention to risk nuclear war? Believe Rep. Tulsi Gabbard, D-HI. She speaks of the matter in her report of meeting with President-elect Trump.
I am a progressive in Gabbard's vein, not a "Y'all Queda" conservative. I oppose the Democrat party because they have used our values as a Trojan horse to bring about corruption and war profiteering. True progressives like Gabbard are those who will restore the legitimacy of progressive ideals such as environmentalism and democratic socialism. I am also fine with environmentally-conscious libertarianism, if that is what the people choose. Unless the corrupt wolves in sheeps' clothing who have hijacked the progressive movement are overthrown, we will never actually accomplish our aims for society.
http://gabbard.house.gov/index.php/press-releases/655-gabbard-statement-on-meeting-with-president-elect-donald-trump
I stand corrected.
We do agree.
Although I seriously doubt that the dangers of war with Russia are significant. Compared to the tensions during the cold war our situation is much better. I doubt that a no fly zone could have led to any serious confrontation even in the event of some sort of catastrophe like a fighter jet being shot down. I'm afraid that I have to interpret this whole issue as being effected by election politics. Scare tactics.