Watch live: View of Gaza City skyline as Israel begins offensive
Watch a skyline view from Gaza City as Israel launches a ground operation on the 10th day of an offensive to stamp out rocket attacks from the Palestinian enclave...
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/10970066/Watch-live-View-of-Gaza-City-skyline-as-Israel-begins-offensive.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/palestinianauthority/10970066/Watch-live-View-of-Gaza-City-skyline-as-Israel-begins-offensive.html)
thankyou for shareing that dude i have been wanting news on the situation there all morning but the local news has just been a 4 hour block about the plane shot down.
At this point, the humanitarian stance is to end this shit. A war is not over until both sides agree it is over or one side is exterminated. Here, we have one side that simply refuses to accept the consequences of losing wars for 70-odd years. Fine.
You keep fighting after you lose?
You keep declining detente and cease-fires?
You keep "electing" leadership dedicated to caliphates, nation-extermination, and terror?
Well, fuck you. Enjoy the flames, irradiation, and explosions. Maybe that would "moderate" half of the religious element which underlies all this nonsense. I say "half" because the god damn end-of-days chrisitians would interpret this as proof of their own, separate, nonsense.
Maybe we have to deal with one outrageous cult at at time.
Welcome, dudes. 8)
Quote from: Red Back Dragon Dude on July 17, 2014, 10:12:35 PM
thankyou for shareing that dude i have been wanting news on the situation there all morning but the local news has just been a 4 hour block about the plane shot down.
the 4 hour block has turned into ALL FREEKING DAY , do you dudes have any info on the situation there ? the local media jackals here are busy tearing the airline story too shreds >.>
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212)
An interesting counter point of view on the situation.
8) IMHO...
(http://www.jr.co.il/humorpic/pc0263.jpg)
A plane from holland to Malaysia was possibly shot down over Ukraine by Russia or rebels
Quote from: meekon5 on July 18, 2014, 11:10:01 AM
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212)
An interesting counter point of view on the situation.
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 18, 2014, 05:52:28 PM
8) IMHO...
(http://www.jr.co.il/humorpic/pc0263.jpg)
yup thats good for me too, that news reporter can go suck a marmot.
Quote from: Red Back Dragon Dude on July 18, 2014, 07:06:00 PM
Quote from: meekon5 on July 18, 2014, 11:10:01 AM
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212 (https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?v=739789052751212)
An interesting counter point of view on the situation.
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 18, 2014, 05:52:28 PM
8) IMHO...
(http://www.jr.co.il/humorpic/pc0263.jpg)
yup thats good for me too, that news reporter can go suck a marmot.
8)(http://dudeism.com/smf/Themes/default/images/post/thumbup.gif)
I think both positions are pretty interesting, just keeping in mind that there really aren't any "good guys"
And as I've said before never believe what your government tells you via TV (goes for any countries), the only reason Israel exists as it does is so the US and NATO are assured a landing strip in the area.
Quote from: meekon5 on July 19, 2014, 09:35:36 AM
And as I've said before never believe what your government tells you via TV (goes for any countries), the only reason Israel exists as it does is so the US and NATO are assured a landing strip in the area.
And updates for Windows Metro 8)(http://dudeism.com/smf/Themes/default/images/post/thumbup.gif)
Quote from: meekon5 on July 19, 2014, 09:35:36 AM
And as I've said before never believe what your government tells you via TV (goes for any countries), the only reason Israel exists as it does is so the US and NATO are assured a landing strip in the area.
Agreed on that 100%. I trust my government (the US) and the sycophantic press corps nestled by its jackboot only slightly less than a wandering pederast who must go door-to-door in his new neighborhood to comply with Megan's Law.
But this chick from your earlier link is a bit loony. Let's take a few examples from the clip that either wrong or, worse, prove essentially the opposite of her points.
1. "Collective punishment of an entire population." Well, this is war. And, as she later states, "Hamas is the democratically-elected government of Gaza." To that extent, then, it's fair to hold the people responsible for the actions of their elected terrorists...er, leaders. I'll concede, in anticipation, that point is just as salient when applied to the US.
2. "Gaza is one of the most densely populated places on Earth." Not to quibble, but it seems generally ranked around 15th. Best I can tell, "Palestine" only makes the top 5 if sorted by features excised from, or at least not included, by her sentence. For example, it's 5th if sorted by political regions (as opposed to geographical regions - i.e., "places" in her terms) with fewer than 5 million people (she uses 1 million). Then, yes, it's pretty high. One might also suspect that a government with such high population density and a comparatively weak military would tend to refrain from antagonizing, and certainly from throwing stones at, stronger neighbors. Perhaps not.
3. "No Israelis have died as the result of Hamas rockets." I can't tell if she realizes how disingenuous this carefully-worded sentence is. In any case, it's wrong on several levels. First, there is no debate Hamas has fired hundreds, likely thousands, of rockets into Israel with lethal intent. We shouldn't congratulate Hamas on the efficacity of Israel's missile shield system. Second, are we parsing Hamas-launched rockets from those of other terror...er, political groups in Palestine? Hamas, again being the duly-elected steward of Palestinian peace, should take some responsibility for rockets launched within its borders by Al Quds, Fatah, and motley other villains over the years. Third, is she only concerned with death or are injuries, amputations, and property damage against Israelis just as damning as against Palestinians. Lastly, are rockets the sole problem? Suicide bombers are potentially lethal - and now, by the way, we have reports of them using donkeys and dogs as bomb carriers. I don't know if its true. If so, I devoutly hope I am wrong in disbelieving in hell.
5. "One is the oppressor; one is the oppressed." Is this to say "one side is winning; the other losing" or "one side is right; the other is wrong"? I don't know. But it isn't sufficiently well-reasoned to bother with.
6. "Every time israel goes on the offensive..." Because Israel is the sole aggressor? Seriously? Which of the parties has voluntarily conceded land? Which has recognized the other may exist? Which routinely informs the other where and when it will destroy buildings? Which could, if it wished, simply obliterate the other?
But, I will say the chick was pretty hot in a semi-sapphic way.
I didn't say I agreed with her.
I do understand the whole issue is highly emotive.
I find the Jews in Israel as problematic as the British in the Falkland Islands.
Dennis Prager offers good insight into the conflict...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA)
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 05:29:25 PM
Dennis Prager offers good insight into conflict...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA)
Thanks for that DB.
Quote from: meekon5 on July 20, 2014, 05:53:06 PM
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 05:29:25 PM
Dennis Prager offers good insight into conflict...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA)
Thanks for that DB.
Welcome, M dude, (http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/7131/66421926facebooklike.jpg)
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 06:06:45 PM
Quote from: meekon5 on July 20, 2014, 05:53:06 PM
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 05:29:25 PM
Dennis Prager offers good insight into conflict...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA)
Thanks for that DB.
Welcome, M dude, (http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/7131/66421926facebooklike.jpg)
Gotta give Prager credit for acknowledging it was a UN (ahem...UK/US) resolution that, basically, took half of Palestine and just called it Israel one day. He doesn't dwell on it but that's a difficult genesis to overcome. I get the Palestinian beef there. But wars were fought and, to paraphrase Mr. Obama, wars have consequences.
Quote from: jgiffin on July 20, 2014, 10:36:06 PM
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 06:06:45 PM
Quote from: meekon5 on July 20, 2014, 05:53:06 PM
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 20, 2014, 05:29:25 PM
Dennis Prager offers good insight into conflict...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HEKwXsmDXOA)
Thanks for that DB.
Welcome, M dude, (http://img842.imageshack.us/img842/7131/66421926facebooklike.jpg)
Gotta give Prager credit for acknowledging it was a UN (ahem...UK/US) resolution that, basically, took half of Palestine and just called it Israel one day. He doesn't dwell on it but that's a difficult genesis to overcome. I get the Palestinian beef there. But wars were fought and, to paraphrase Mr. Obama, wars have consequences.
"it was a UN (ahem...UK/US) resolution that, basically, took half of Palestine and just called it Israel one day"
That's the bit that gets me.
If the US and some other country gave half of the UK back to the descendents of the Vikings because they used to run the place hundreds of years ago, I would be a little upset.
Do remember the Jews are only one twelfth of the tribes of Israel, the tribe of Judah. So in fact are not all the descendents of Israel.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-22/bombardment-intense-but-necessary-say-israeli/5613428 (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-22/bombardment-intense-but-necessary-say-israeli/5613428)
this is a serious interview... interviewing a guy who looks just like mort from family guy >. > i wonder if they actually hand picked him or if he was the only resident that speaks English.
Quote from: meekon5 on July 21, 2014, 06:52:43 AM
If the US and some other country gave half of the UK back to the descendents of the Vikings because they used to run the place hundreds of years ago, I would be a little upset.
If vikings were a significant voting block and/or had their own PAC in US politics, I'd place the odds at about 40%. And that's taking into account the "special relationship" between the two countries.
I don't agree with Noam Chomsky much but he's on-point with regard to the ruling power structures...well, that and the whole linguistics thing.
I find it a bit disturbing that for 10 years hamas, from the Gaza Strip, has rained down literately thousands of deadly missile attacks on Israel indiscriminately firing to kill anyone they can and the UN, world governments, so-called "peace organizations, and other organizations, were not whining about "an end to the violence," but as soon as Israel (which takes up a mere two percent of the Middle East) decides to stand up and defend itself, the whole damn world is suddenly screaming for peace and blaming Israel for the conflict.
The word "BULLSHIT" comes to mind.
(http://c7.nrostatic.com/sites/default/files/BsEnyC1CIAA8tMe.png)
The History of the Middle East Conflict in 11 Minutes - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZY8m0cm1oY (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZY8m0cm1oY)
Deadly? I think the Gaza fireworks have probably killed fewer people than have died tripping over chickens.
Quote from: jdurand on July 27, 2014, 11:08:56 PM
Deadly? I think the Gaza fireworks have probably killed fewer people than have died tripping over chickens.
One missile, one death, is an act of internationally illegal aggressive war.
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 18, 2014, 05:52:28 PM
8) IMHO...
(http://www.jr.co.il/humorpic/pc0263.jpg)
even if this is true, it doesn't change one VERY simple thing about war: it doesn't matter 'who started first'.
hold onto your rotten tomatoes, hear me out.
it may matter for justice, but what justice are we talking about when everyone is on a quest for vengeance? what's worse, it's all justified vengeance - we have bitter people who had their friends and/or relatives taken from them by the opposite side of the conflict. probably by other people who had theirs taken by the opposite side. It's a neverending downwards spiral.
People try to figure out 'true justice' and find who's right and who's wrong by digging deep inside history, and that is not a good thing to do, because the deeper you dig, the more violent the people were, not to mention there won't be a 'black vs white' or 'good vs evil' answer there. Just a bunch of rules fighting over territory at the cost of people who didn't care for their conflict. The Dudes of different nations, views and religious beliefs.
It's them who get hurt - either physically or mentally if their close ones are hurt or killed. They don't care who and why dropped that bomb or if it was justified. They just lose everything they loved, pick a gun and fire back without a moment of doubt or mercy.
It's a neverending cycle of violence breeds violence that is usually created manually but fuelled automatically by the growing mutual hatred. This conflict won't end until one side completely destroys the other, but then the remnants of the defeted side will terrorize the victors.
I am disappointed in this world. People either never learn or don't want to. Violence as a problem solving tool is frowned upon formally, but is supported factually. Compassion is a non-existent illusion which people only seem to turn on when it's convenient and turn off once it becomes difficult.
It will only stop when people are truly ready to forgive and forget. But that of course means it never will.
P.S. an interesting read on the subject of territorial dispute between Israel and Palestine:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearing-palestine-vs-jewish-loss-of-land/5354751 (http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearing-palestine-vs-jewish-loss-of-land/5354751)
Quote from: Bullett00th on July 28, 2014, 11:45:01 AM
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 18, 2014, 05:52:28 PM
8) IMHO...
(http://www.jr.co.il/humorpic/pc0263.jpg)
even if this is true, it doesn't change one VERY simple thing about war: it doesn't matter 'who started first'.
hold onto your rotten tomatoes, hear me out.
it may matter for justice, but what justice are we talking about when everyone is on a quest for vengeance? what's worse, it's all justified vengeance - we have bitter people who had their friends and/or relatives taken from them by the opposite side of the conflict. probably by other people who had theirs taken by the opposite side. It's a neverending downwards spiral.
People try to figure out 'true justice' and find who's right and who's wrong by digging deep inside history, and that is not a good thing to do, because the deeper you dig, the more violent the people were, not to mention there won't be a 'black vs white' or 'good vs evil' answer there. Just a bunch of rules fighting over territory at the cost of people who didn't care for their conflict. The Dudes of different nations, views and religious beliefs.
It's them who get hurt - either physically or mentally if their close ones are hurt or killed. They don't care who and why dropped that bomb or if it was justified. They just lose everything they loved, pick a gun and fire back without a moment of doubt or mercy.
It's a neverending cycle of violence breeds violence that is usually created manually but fuelled automatically by the growing mutual hatred. This conflict won't end until one side completely destroys the other, but then the remnants of the defeted side will terrorize the victors.
I am disappointed in this world. People either never learn or don't want to. Violence as a problem solving tool is frowned upon formally, but is supported factually. Compassion is a non-existent illusion which people only seem to turn on when it's convenient and turn off once it becomes difficult.
It will only stop when people are truly ready to forgive and forget. But that of course means it never will.
P.S. an interesting read on the subject of territorial dispute between Israel and Palestine:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearing-palestine-vs-jewish-loss-of-land/5354751 (http://www.globalresearch.ca/disappearing-palestine-vs-jewish-loss-of-land/5354751)
G'Day dude , you most defiantly speak your heart there but the sad truth is that islam will never forgive or forget on an international level it promotes NOT letting things go ... just the other day http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-28/an-phils-militant-attack-talipao/5629884 (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-28/an-phils-militant-attack-talipao/5629884) (that article sheds some on the ground light) with both violence and peace Islam wants the infidels (people like you and me) gone. in peace they basically want too "out breed" us bet you've noticed a lot more people with faith in islam around haven't you ? did you know they wanted too build a mega mosque just down the road from the twin towers ? just the other week sydney was filled with Muslims of the Eid al-Fitr festival in the long run we are all of us in a fight for our lives for me i'm gay that means to them that i should be killed... for loveing i should be killed to me the best thing any of us here can do is cross our fingers and wish for the monster to go away but that dosent mean we shouldent show our support for people in an active daily fight for the lives against the Islam war machine like we do here in the forums we need to let our leaders that we do not want to let islam continue too wipe us out... if anything could be called an ancient powerful weapon that's what i would be calling islam.
did i mention all of what i just said allso gives them justification to murder me ? well it does thank fuck we dont have sharia law.
nother update for yall aswell
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-29/children2c-soldiers-killed-as-palestinian-fighters-cross-border/5630560 (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-29/children2c-soldiers-killed-as-palestinian-fighters-cross-border/5630560)
Quote from: Bullett00th on July 28, 2014, 11:45:01 AM
It's a neverending cycle of violence breeds violence that is usually created manually but fuelled automatically by the growing mutual hatred. This conflict won't end until one side completely destroys the other, but then the remnants of the defeted side will terrorize the victors.
Sorry for taking this quote entirely out of context but there's a nugget of truth here worth panning. Ergo, my question: is it worse to settle the question now at the expense of much life on both sides and the entire liquidation of one side (i.e., Palestinians given the current power balance), or, should we instead bear witness to a slow-motion battle which culls a significant - though lesser - percentage of every generation on both sides in perpetuity.
Quote from: Red Back Dragon Dude on July 28, 2014, 07:40:14 PM
...the sad truth is that islam will never forgive or forget on an international level...
I am sorry but you are completely wrong. This is not Islam, this is a small group of middle eastern countries that are making a lot of noise and using the excuse of their religion to cover their actions. Much like the Christian Crusades in the middle ages, land grab designed as religious right.
If this was actually in line with Islam more countries in the world would be involved.
These are Islamic states:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/31/Islam_by_country.png/1024px-Islam_by_country.png)
You are being confused by interested parties that want to undermine the few states in order to take over their oil production.
These ar the areas Western media are focusing on:
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5565/14772199561_5080d347a6_o.png) (https://flic.kr/p/ovnogT)1024px-Islam_by_country_highlight (https://flic.kr/p/ovnogT) by meekon5 (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
IMHDO.
Quote from: meekon5 on July 29, 2014, 05:57:27 AM
Quote from: Red Back Dragon Dude on July 28, 2014, 07:40:14 PM
...the sad truth is that islam will never forgive or forget on an international level...
I am sorry but you are completely wrong. This is not Islam, this is a small group of middle eastern countries that are making a lot of noise and using the excuse of their religion to cover their actions. Much like the Christian Crusades in the middle ages, land grab designed as religious right.
If this was actually in line with Islam more countries in the world would be involved.
These are Islamic states:
(http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/31/Islam_by_country.png/1024px-Islam_by_country.png)
You are being confused by interested parties that want to undermine the few states in order to take over their oil production.
These ar the areas Western media are focusing on:
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5565/14772199561_5080d347a6_o.png) (https://flic.kr/p/ovnogT)1024px-Islam_by_country_highlight (https://flic.kr/p/ovnogT) by meekon5 (https://www.flickr.com/people//), on Flickr
IMHDO.
i cant say that i can agree with your assertion that i am completely wrong... confused maybe indeed i am , mislead by the media i would defiantly say even myself with but completely wrong? well look i dont want too come too heads with any dude but lets look at this chart.
(http://cdn.static-economist.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/original-size/images/2013/12/blogs/graphic-detail/20131214_gdm947_0.png)
very similar to yours aint it ?
Quote from: Red Back Dragon Dude on July 28, 2014, 07:40:14 PM
G'Day dude , you most defiantly speak your heart there but the sad truth is that islam will never forgive or forget on an international level it promotes NOT letting things go ... just the other day http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-28/an-phils-militant-attack-talipao/5629884 (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-28/an-phils-militant-attack-talipao/5629884) (that article sheds some on the ground light) with both violence and peace Islam wants the infidels (people like you and me) gone. in peace they basically want too "out breed" us bet you've noticed a lot more people with faith in islam around haven't you ? did you know they wanted too build a mega mosque just down the road from the twin towers ? just the other week sydney was filled with Muslims of the Eid al-Fitr festival in the long run we are all of us in a fight for our lives for me i'm gay that means to them that i should be killed... for loveing i should be killed to me the best thing any of us here can do is cross our fingers and wish for the monster to go away but that dosent mean we shouldent show our support for people in an active daily fight for the lives against the Islam war machine like we do here in the forums we need to let our leaders that we do not want to let islam continue too wipe us out... if anything could be called an ancient powerful weapon that's what i would be calling islam.
did i mention all of what i just said allso gives them justification to murder me ? well it does thank fuck we dont have sharia law.
the forced spread of Muslims is a different topic to be discussed, and Muslims themselves are different from each other. There?s fanatics and then there?s just believers who never want to spread their religion with violence or don?t want to spread it at all. As in, a Muslim can be a Dude because why not? There are many quotes from the Quran that promote violence towards non-believers, but some of them are taken out of context and some are just ignored by good Muslims.
https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130419054619AAwNQlE (https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130419054619AAwNQlE)
Now I?m not here to justify the promotion of religious violence. Just bear in mind that Islam is a relatively young religion ? it?s about the same age that Christianity was during the dark ages, and we all know far too well what things it justified back then ? in a way far worse than what Islamic fanatics do today. A young religion is like an aggressive teenager striving for dominance and attention. Notice that the older a religion is, the more peaceful it is. Hinduism goes back to 3000 BC with its roots. How many Hindu fanatics blowing up buildings do you see in the news? There.
Again, I?m not saying there isn?t a problem and that something shouldn?t be done. I?m just saying that war isn?t this something. It doesn?t work.
Quote from: jgiffin on July 28, 2014, 09:56:31 PM
is it worse to settle the question now at the expense of much life on both sides and the entire liquidation of one side (i.e., Palestinians given the current power balance), or, should we instead bear witness to a slow-motion battle which culls a significant - though lesser - percentage of every generation on both sides in perpetuity.
This is something I?ve been asking myself for some time now. I don?t know.
You can say that this is how the conflict was solved with native Americans. There?s no war now, no hate, just a black spot in history where an empire used genocide to get hold of a territory and slavery to develop it. Would it be better if people left the natives alone? We?ll never know for sure.
I?d always vouch for peace but apparently this is never the option. Killing a person who has radically different beliefs is easier than trying to find common ground with them.
Quote from: meekon5 on July 29, 2014, 05:57:27 AM
This is not Islam, this is a small group of middle eastern countries that are making a lot of noise and using the excuse of their religion to cover their actions. Much like the Christian Crusades in the middle ages, land grab designed as religious right.
There! This is the truth. You can?t condemn a whole group of people for the deeds of its part.
I always say that an asshole is the most tolerant concept in the world: it doesn?t discriminate by race, gender, age, religion or any other traits. There are assholes in every group no matter how you categorize people, and if you judge the whole group by its asshole part, then we live in a world of assholes :)
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/549548_10151009408268842_978235526_n.jpg)
Quote from: meekon5 on July 29, 2014, 03:26:17 PM
(https://scontent-a-lhr.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/t1.0-9/549548_10151009408268842_978235526_n.jpg)
The problem with such a statement is that it kills individuality and robs a person of a healthy pride of being what they are. Also, it is an attempt to melt everyone into one giant zero identity blob. We need diversity, we need different cultures, we need different ways of seeing things, etc. Krishnamurti's philosophy would turn humanity into an ant colony, everyone the same. Very dangerous! Differences do not have to breed violence as long as people respect the differences. And, yes; a man seeking to understand violence can indeed belong to a distinct political party, country, religion or partial system. Diversity is natural and healthy, as is a desire to be different, unique and genuine.
Under Krishnamurti's philosophy, we should not be identifying ourselves as "Dudeists."
That's just like my opinion, man. 8)
So when you don't belong to any religion, political party or country, haven't you just separated yourself from the rest of humanity. If you follow the rational of the quote, would you be being violent, then? And on a side note, I do belong to 'groups' and sadly, I understand violence all too well.
But, that's just like, my opinion, man.
Always abiding.
Quote from: Ynot Dude on July 29, 2014, 06:41:05 PM
So when you don't belong to any religion, political party or country, haven't you just separated yourself from the rest of humanity.
No, why should you be separated? You mean dudes can't belong to separate clubs, separate ideas, separate points of view and still be part of the rest of humanity? Why so?
No, nothing of the sort. It appears he's saying you must abandon all groups lest you be considered violent. But by relinquishing all ties wouldn't you be separating yourself and therefore should be considered violent? Or am I reading too much into this? I think I pulled a muscle in the old cranial cavity,
Always abiding.
This may not make sense, so I apologize in advance.
For me, diversity and noticing diversity isn't a bad thing. I'm a pointillism artist, which is similar to how I see the world.
One dot is just that: one insignificant point. But together each different dot, different colors, different sizes, imperfect, different places, each one different and unique yet together a big picture that each dot is only piece of. Each one is unique yet has one thing in common: it's a dot. Just a single imperfect silly dot in a unique position making up one beautiful image.
Quote from: Masked Dude on July 29, 2014, 08:28:23 PM
This may not make sense, so I apologize in advance.
For me, diversity and noticing diversity isn't a bad thing. I'm a pointillism artist, which is similar to how I see the world.
One dot is just that: one insignificant point. But together each different dot, different colors, different sizes, imperfect, different places, each one different and unique yet together a big picture that each dot is only piece of. Each one is unique yet has one thing in common: it's a dot. Just a single imperfect silly dot in a unique position making up one beautiful image.
It makes perfect sense! This is such a great and beautiful way to look at things. If everyone in the world looked and thought about life in this way think how much better off we'd ALL be!
Also, just wanted to say that Pointillism Art is Amazing when its finished but takes
almost infinite patience to make, IMDO. Hahaha!
Quote from: DigitalBuddha on July 29, 2014, 05:46:05 PM
The problem with such a statement is that it kills individuality and robs a person of a healthy pride of being what they are. Also, it is an attempt to melt everyone into one giant zero identity blob. We need diversity, we need different cultures, we need different ways of seeing things, etc. Krishnamurti's philosophy would turn humanity into an ant colony, everyone the same. Very dangerous! Differences do not have to breed violence as long as people respect the differences. And, yes; a man seeking to understand violence can indeed belong to a distinct political party, country, religion or partial system. Diversity is natural and healthy, as is a desire to be different, unique and genuine.
Under Krishnamurti's philosophy, we should not be identifying ourselves as "Dudeists."
That's just like my opinion, man. 8)
I think you're taking his statement way too literally.
It's ok to belong to a group. it's not, I believe, ok to automatically take in all the traits of a group. THIS is when you lose your individiality - when you identify yourself with a certain group based on an amount of traits you share with its members AND just accept the group traits that would normally not drive your behavior.
This is a thin line where religion turns into fanatism, patriotism turns into nationalism and any other form of group becoming an extreme interpretation of itself.
You should hold your right to identify yourself with a group of people but remain an individual within it, and that is way more difficult than it sounds. The process of blending in a crowd is smooth and barely noticeable. And so is the process of growing hatred for another group.
It is the "big game v little game" as described by Ekhart Tolle.
The big game there are no labels and no groups, there just is. For this discussion in the big game we are all just human, and no other deliniating label is required, in fact it is contrary to understanding and enlightenment.
The little game is fine, make up labels, groups and rules and what ever decent thing you want to do. It is only the "little game" a hyper reality, not real just a game.
What he is saying here is that when you chose to believe the little game is real and the big game is the hyper reality, then you are carving up the true reality of us all being just humans. The act of dividing things is an act of violence in a sense, and when we cling to those division it leads to violence in actuality.
Basically this is just a rephrasing of the first verse of the Tao, there are no groups, no names and no labels, there just is the Tao.
"I am" is the only reality, every other descriptor is a hyper reality.
Thus, Dudeists exist, but Dudeism is just a hyper reality, a game, not real just something we are doing because it brings us joy. But in the end it is nothing. But as long as we recognize it is just a game then we are free to have all the fun we want. By always remembering the big game, the Tao, then all our little games can be fun and life reaffirming adventures.
Posted a separate topic about it, then realized this song (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-evIyrrjTTY) is exactly about the neverending conflicts in the land discussed.
Quote from: revgms on July 30, 2014, 11:40:01 AM
It is the "big game v little game" as described by Ekhart Tolle.
The big game there are no labels and no groups, there just is. For this discussion in the big game we are all just human, and no other deliniating label is required, in fact it is contrary to understanding and enlightenment.
The little game is fine, make up labels, groups and rules and what ever decent thing you want to do. It is only the "little game" a hyper reality, not real just a game.
What he is saying here is that when you chose to believe the little game is real and the big game is the hyper reality, then you are carving up the true reality of us all being just humans. The act of dividing things is an act of violence in a sense, and when we cling to those division it leads to violence in actuality.
Basically this is just a rephrasing of the first verse of the Tao, there are no groups, no names and no labels, there just is the Tao.
"I am" is the only reality, every other descriptor is a hyper reality.
Thus, Dudeists exist, but Dudeism is just a hyper reality, a game, not real just something we are doing because it brings us joy. But in the end it is nothing. But as long as we recognize it is just a game then we are free to have all the fun we want. By always remembering the big game, the Tao, then all our little games can be fun and life reaffirming adventures.
That is very, very good. I need to start reading Tao te Ching...
That said I don't think we can separate ourselves from the idea of categorization yet. It will take a very long time, if it will ever happen at all...
Revgms, thank you, I was thinking in spirals trying to wrap my brain around it. Overthinking. I've started studying Taoism only recently, and it really makes sense to me.
The game thus far...
(https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10514723_791821437544654_7196174284139491775_n.jpg?oh=8790b7e0cc5b6ba57629555d41bbb6bd&oe=54598C88&__gda__=1415155796_3d5665a8dfd226ac4669c2c0ab500fd9)
The only thing I'm gonna say about this whole circus is that both sides are wrong and it should just stop.
Why not create a new nation? Let's call it Palestisrael.
Shake hands, live together, take it easy, amen.
Er...I guess I would blame the extremists on both sides. Clearly there are assholes on both sides of that border. I would bet there are millions of citizens on both sides who would rather chill the fuck out and go back to doing business together, so they can all make money, not war. But Hamas sucks and so do the extremists in Israel.
Quote from: Nervine on July 31, 2014, 10:41:39 AM
The only thing I'm gonna say about this whole circus is that both sides are wrong and it should just stop.
Why not create a new nation? Let's call it Palestisrael.
Shake hands, live together, take it easy, amen.
The world doesn't work like that, and it's easy to say when you don't know the motives of these people. Seeing a friend's or relative's mutilated body is a sight disturbing enough to make even a pacifist wish death to those who pulled the trigger or launched the missile and ANYONE associated with them. Maybe they would even want to pull the trigger themselves and fire back. They won't think about the fact that they will probably kill someone who has friends and family who never wanted this conflict. This is how this plague spreads. Like fire.
Quote from: revgms on July 31, 2014, 11:17:56 AM
Er...I guess I would blame the extremists on both sides. Clearly there are assholes on both sides of that border. I would bet there are millions of citizens on both sides who would rather chill the fuck out and go back to doing business together, so they can all make money, not war. But Hamas sucks and so do the extremists in Israel.
as always. as with Russia and Ukraine. as with USA and Russia. The list goes on.
These hatreds are stupid and mostly artificial. I mean if it was the whole nation then the whole world would despise Germany for a long time, especially ex-USSR countries. There is zero hatred for Germans though, even quite the contrary.
Assholes abound on both sides. Abso-fucking-lutely.
But, to date, only one side has a democratically elected party with a platform expressly stating the other side doesn't have a right to exist (or, in an alternate translation, should be obliterated - feel free to parse the vast semantic distinction).
I dunno, every time I hear one side or the other speak all I hear is...
http://youtu.be/J1uL3TqAlbk (http://youtu.be/J1uL3TqAlbk)
Quote from: revgms on August 01, 2014, 07:25:23 PM
I dunno, every time I hear one side or the other speak all I hear is...
http://youtu.be/J1uL3TqAlbk (http://youtu.be/J1uL3TqAlbk)
Disturbed are spot on with their lyrics about politics and war. Avarice (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1d491Ktj_Uw) is another great example, as well as Device's Out of Line (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bsx-1-IrZ5s).
The song I've found it's easiest to relate to when it comes to artificial conflicts is We Believe by Ministry (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oUcQnl6zdkE):
Tensions on both sides
We're paralyzed and victimized
We're terrified and petrified
Demoralized and mortified
Of genocide and suicide
And patricide and cyanide
We're pacified by every side
Force-fed pride and then we die for them