No, Jane, I can't Spare a Square...and You Shouldn't be in the Men's Room

[jgiffin]

The Federal government threatens to withhold funding to schools that don't let boys poop next to girls. Or, in the modern parlance of our NY Times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/13/us/politics/obama-administration-to-issue-decree-on-transgender-access-to-school-restrooms.html?_r=0

I'm done. Finished. Fuck it. It's apparently not enough for the Feds to steal our tax dollars through express or implied force, squander it on ridiculous pork-barrel projects, and lavish it upon their incestuous fuck-buddy lobbyists and political contributors. Noooo, the Feds also have to precondition the return of said tax dollars upon states and municipalities cowering to their unlawful, wrong-headed, and demagogic political aims; to wit, a baseless and unilateral declaration that boys who think they're girls that day must be allowed to poop in the girls' restroom. Well, did anyone bother to ask the girls whether they're cool with that? Fuck no. Not the point.

The absurdity of the White House's position is only slightly surpassed by its obscenity. And don't fucking dare try to pull this under the Civil Rights Act of 1964. I've read it. They, apparently, have not. Gender identity isn't mentioned. You want to include it? Fine. Pass a law. But not this way. This is all separate and apart from the disaster this is wrecking on the poor little confused fuckwits. They want to sip on their bitchy little Nalgenes to avoid ingesting 1 nano-spectro-gram of BPA but are fine dosing kids with 12 giga-watts of hormones and seeing how that plays. They ignore increased suicide rates and other indica of mental instability. Whatever.

I'm telling you: this way leads to revolution. If I had a prepubescent son or daughter, I'd lead the charge myself - today. I don't, and I have some financial wherewithal, and I'm impatient, so I'm just leaving the country. If any state secedes from the union in the interim, though, and pledges not to turn over its citizen's money to the Feds, I'm moving there immediately. It's long overdue. And, yes, that turned out poorly the last time. But we'll just have to take our chances.

[SagebrushSage]

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[SagebrushSage]

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[SagebrushSage]

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[Brother D]

I am not going to pretend to understand gender issues, it's a PC minefield. I feel that people should be free to be who and what they are and the attitude surrounding those issues are unnecessary today. I try to accept people for who they are, not what there identity may be.

Like you say, change is happening so fast, it's gonna take a while for the world to catch up, but it'll get there, man.

[LotsaBadKarma]

http://louderwithcrowder.com/not-normal-transgender-man-claims-hes-6-year-old-girl-abandons-family/

When you watch the video pay attention to the part about the subject of the video, the 52 year old man who left his wife and 6 kids to run off and be a six year old girl, and how this might just be indicative of a fairly severe mental disorder and then say that it's just dandy for him to accompany your daughter or granddaughter into the restroom so they can fix their respective make-up and take a zesty dump.
You know, as members and clergy of the Church of the Latter Day Dude, I don't recall any part of the sign-up process wherein it was stated that we either had to abandon our individual opinions (and the ability to express them) at the door or willingly accept the idea of our fellow clergy going all Walter on us for having an opinion that differs. I mean the whole idea of an enlightened group like this is being able to have a conversation without resorting to calling each other names that accomplish nothing more than the end of a sensitive conversation.
For example, I happen to believe that this whole trans-toilet thing is yet another of the orchestrated efforts of people in power to divide the proletariat into smaller and smaller groups based upon nothing more than differences of opinion. I actually see my theory at work right here in this thread. I also happen to believe that everybody has the right to privacy and the right to feel safe especially when they are inside the restroom and even more especially when they are children. And remember that I haven't mentioned anybody raping anybody or looking to make someone a victim. I'm just saying that this is some borderline psycho bullshit. If you have a penis you go to the boys' toilet, if you have a vagina you go to the girls' toilet. If you can't make the distinction you maybe go to see a psychiatrist.

[LotsaBadKarma]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHt7EBCgJnI

[SagebrushSage]

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[Brother D]

Having unisex/ gender neutral bathrooms is one thing, (the context of the original post), but the content of clip 1, is another.

Identifying as a 6 year old girl is IMO indicative of delusion in this case, I would not let my children play with them, let alone act on impulse. It is paedophillia dressed up (literally) as a trans issue.

There are fetishes involving reverting to child-like behaviour for often sexual benefit. (Adult babies for example).

Clip 2, is not a fair test as it would have to be conducted from the other point of view, (trans using a male bathroom), which would have different results I suspect.

It is a controversial topic fer sure.

[LotsaBadKarma]

If this was just a case of a school or other public (taxpayer supported) edifice being required to build "gender neutral" bathrooms I don't see where it would be a big problem. I mean, tax money gets spent on worse things. But I'm not sure that's the case. Of course, it could be slanted and biased reporting that's causing the fear and loathing over this issue. But I'm thinking that what is being discussed here is the idea that the bathrooms that already exist are going to be labelled as "gender neutral". So do I care if someone who identifies themselves in a certain way elects to sit down in the stall next to mine and drop a deuce? Not really.

It seems that the tipping point here is how this might negatively impact a child who might have to try to reason out for themselves what this person of the opposite sex is doing in a place that repetition has taught them is exclusively either for boys or for girls. What does dad or grandpa do when he walks his daughter (or granddaughter) to the door of the ladies' bathroom and stands guard at the door only to have an adult male walk past him into that same facility? Do you take the chance that the person is well intention-ed and do you hold off because you don't want to offend someone only to find out that they had another agenda and that child is now scarred for life, perhaps physically as well as mentally?

Speaking only for myself I can honestly say that when I become verbally "aggressive" about a particular topic it is because something in that discussion causes a fear response in me and it is more acceptable for me, as an American male, to demonstrate rage and perhaps borderline bigotry than it is to show fear. This whole thing is a big step and it's not an easy one to expect people to just accept until they see that it is being handled in such a way as to minimize or eliminate unnecessary risks to those that we care about. And the idea of victimizing schoolchildren in states that don't comply with this "law" by withholding federal education funds is, in fact, particularly reprehensible. If this was actually the right thing to spring on the public would such a threat actually be needed? I'm thinking not.

[SagebrushSage]

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[Brother D]

It seems that the tipping point here is how this might negatively impact a child who might have to try to reason out for themselves what this person of the opposite sex is doing in a place that repetition has taught them is exclusively either for boys or for girls. What does dad or grandpa do when he walks his daughter (or granddaughter) to the door of the ladies' bathroom and stands guard at the door only to have an adult male walk past him into that same facility? Do you take the chance that the person is well intention-ed and do you hold off because you don't want to offend someone only to find out that they had another agenda and that child is now scarred for life, perhaps physically as well as mentally?

Speaking only for myself I can honestly say that when I become verbally "aggressive" about a particular topic it is because something in that discussion causes a fear response in me and it is more acceptable for me, as an American male, to demonstrate rage and perhaps borderline bigotry than it is to show fear. This whole thing is a big step and it's not an easy one to expect people to just accept until they see that it is being handled in such a way as to minimize or eliminate unnecessary risks to those that we care about. And the idea of victimizing schoolchildren in states that don't comply with this "law" by withholding federal education funds is, in fact, particularly reprehensible. If this was actually the right thing to spring on the public would such a threat actually be needed? I'm thinking not.

In the first instance, I think that educating/ teaching younger generations that people of a different gender are just as human as they are and have as much right to use the same facility as them, IMO is a positive attitude that will lead to the breakdown of social stereotypes and stigma.

As for their agenda, well dude, we just don't know. I certainly don't. There are incidents of abuse and worse in some cases, but for the most part, they are there for the same reason. (No's 1 and 2).

Your response to conversation that makes you feel uncomfortable or uptight is understandable, man,  we've all done it, at least you recognise it stems from fear or a lack of understanding or whatever, so, dudos to you. I can't or shouldn't tell you how to act, it's not my place to do so.

Sometimes seeing things in text form gives us insight into our own character. (Well, it works for me, sometimes I type things our 2 or 3 times before posting and occasionally still get it wrong).

[Brother D]

It is not difficult to explain trans people to kids.  "Some boys like to live like girls, and some girls like to live like boys, and that's okay."  One sentence.  You can tell the difference between trans and cis people by how they dress.  It's not exactly hard.  Do what the Dude would do.  Don't worry about it, and it'll be fine.

Just use your judgement, dude.  Get to know some trans people, and you'll be able to tell the difference between a transsexual and a sexual predator, no problem.

Ed: The explanation for gay people is similarly easy: "Sometimes, men love men or women love women, and that's okay."

I dig your style, dude :-)

[SagebrushSage]

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[DigitalBuddha]

What I have read in here so far is just like everyone's opinion, man, no harm intended.