Gun Rights Aren't A Left/Right Issue

[BikerDude]

Yeah he's a bit of a dork but you can't help but applaud.
The "go fuck yourself" parts are spot on.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrmc_1vTf6w

[DigitalBuddha]

Fuckin' eh!!

[RandoRock]

It's just one more thing in the long list of issues that we "have" to be divided on. People can't help but draw a line in the sand even if it defies all logic or reason. I love my guns and it's not because of some deep seeded insecurities or over stretched paranoia, hell if I'm completely honest with myself I'm pretty much a pacifist since I see violence as a last resort. It's simply for the fact that going to the range is relaxing to me. I like having a skill I can work on and continue to develop. I also conceal carry just for the simple fact that you never know. You never know when some orange haired idiot is going to start blasting during Batman, you never know when some disgruntled former co-worker is going to come into the Holiday Party with a shotgun and a chip on his shoulder, and for me personally since I work in a prison I never know if a former inmate might try to make good on one of the many threats I've received over the years. In my opinion, which I'm sure most of you have gathered I have quite a few of, it's never been about paranoia or trying to be some vigilante hero and save the day, it's always just been about keeping an even playing field. Some bad people out there have guns and all I would like, if the situation ever arises, is the means to equally defend my family and myself. Plus it's also pretty entertaining to get a good target shoot going.

[Reverend Al]

...it's never been about paranoia or trying to be some vigilante hero and save the day, it's always just been about keeping an even playing field. Some bad people out there have guns and all I would like, if the situation ever arises, is the means to equally defend my family and myself...

I agree.  The problem with gun control is that the only people who will abide by the laws are the responsible gun owners/users; the "criminals" aren't going to play by any new rules any more than they're playing by the current rules.  But if you level the playing field, it's going to make at least some of these "shooters" think twice because they'll know some of their "victims" are going to shoot back.  Now, I realize that sounds like a rather un-Dude position on the matter and that it's more in line with the way Walter would deal with gun control.  But if I were to find myself in a situation in which some nutcase has decided to use me and/or the people I care about for target practice, I would definitely want the means to defend myself.

The thing these "gun control" proponents don't seem to realize is that the guns aren't the problem.  You could throw a party with 500 people in attendance, put a loaded handgun on a table in the center of the party, and no one would get hurt.  That is, until some idiot picks up that gun.  And, of course, there are those who would say, "But if the gun wasn't there in the first place..."  Fair enough.  But if someone is determined to cause harm to someone else they would simply choose another means--a baseball bat, a hammer, a brick, a bottle, or whatever else is handy.  Should we outlaw those items as well?

[jgiffin]

It's only a left/right issue because the professional left (Democrats) and the professional right (Republicans) have made it so.

The professional left wants a disarmed public that must rely on government protection and can't resort to armed insurrection against the litany of unconstitutional intrusions they support.

The professional right wants to use gun-rights as a clarion call for their supporters to vote for them in perpetuity and ignore all the other unconstitutional shit they support.

[RandoRock]

Exactly right and well said. The only way gun control could ever solve anything is if there was a 100% guaranteed way to get rid of all the guns. That's just not possible because like you said there would always be a criminal element that doesn't give a shit about the rules. Like most other things though people refuse to look at facts and just bury their head deeper and deeper in the sand. Almost all mass shootings happen in anti-gun zones, there have been more mass shooting during Obama's war on gun presidency then there have been during the terms of the past 4 presidents before him, and all these gun control advocates don't seem to know the current laws the anti-gunners spout out terms like gun show loop hole and automatic weapons even though all the same gun laws regarding background checks and permits apply at gun shows and you cannot purchase an automatic weapon anywhere in the whole country unless it was imported/manufactured before the ban that took place decades ago.

The main rallying cry of the anti-gunner is "Stricter Background Checks!" or the ol' guilt trip "How can anyone be opposed to more thorough background checks?" When the truth of the matter is the background checks are already as thorough as they can be. They are the same checks run by the damn FBI and they check through every criminal database there is. All these new legislations and executive orders really do is put policies in place for the federal government to deny selling guns to people who otherwise pass the checks. According to new legislation in California because I take Vyvanse the government can come to my house and take my guns because I might be unstable....Vyvanse is an ADD med and I have a spotless criminal record. It's the same thing with the whole terrorist watch list, I know that denying people on that list seems like a no brainer but the problem is there federal government decides who goes on that list and they can put anyone they decide on there with no notice to them, no due process, no chance to appeal, and no real definition of what qualifies someone as a terrorist suspect. This might sound like paranoid gun nut talk but the sad truth is its not. You can look all this up on the various government most people are just to lazy to actually do the research. 

[jgiffin]

The whole issue is just another ludicrous (if lucrative) way that our political masters divide and conquer us. Consider the following.

The gun-rights issue is really quite settled for those able to read. The constitution is clear - the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed. SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED. So, sorry, all the existing laws limiting gun ownership are null and void in a constitutional republic. Yes, that means even those laws which make sense and have 95% approval (e.g., felons not having the right, background checks, requiring licenses and permits, etc). I'm not saying those aren't good ideas. But to implement them you have to amend the fucking constitution, not just ignore it.

After the Charleston shooting in a black church, all we heard about was closing the "Charleston Loophole" so it couldn't happen again. They say the guy was able to get a gun because his background check was delayed for too long. WRONG. The government fucked up his background check and approved him when they shouldn't have. Stop blaming the laws and start blaming the people who break them (criminals) or the people who don't implement them correctly (politicians...but, well, they're also criminals).

Neither side (right/left) want to "fix" any existing problems, regarding guns or anything else. They'd rather keep the issue alive for fundraising and demagoguery. After all, they're not impacted by the consequences of their policies. There aren't shootings in Sen. McConnell's neighborhood. Obama's kids don't go to an underfunded school plagued with illegal aliens. No, we get to suffer the impact of their bullshit laws. And when we rightfully raise our voices, we're called intolerant or racist or...fuck it, I'm going bowling.

[RandoRock]

I've always found it ironic that every anti-gunner is always surrounded by armed security. The Pope was calling for tougher gun laws in America and he is constantly surrounded by a small Army. Hillary will go on stage and claim that guns don't protect people and there should be no guns anywhere, all the while she is not more than 10 feet from her armed bodyguards....

[Reverend Al]

I've always found it ironic that every anti-gunner is always surrounded by armed security. The Pope was calling for tougher gun laws in America and he is constantly surrounded by a small Army. Hillary will go on stage and claim that guns don't protect people and there should be no guns anywhere, all the while she is not more than 10 feet from her armed bodyguards....

Yep.  When they say "Nobody should have guns," what they really mean is "Nobody should have guns except for the people we think should have guns."

[jgiffin]

I've always found it ironic that every anti-gunner is always surrounded by armed security. The Pope was calling for tougher gun laws in America and he is constantly surrounded by a small Army. Hillary will go on stage and claim that guns don't protect people and there should be no guns anywhere, all the while she is not more than 10 feet from her armed bodyguards....

Good point. I also like how that hypocritical old virgin (the pope, not Hill-dog) chastises others for having the temerity to propose building walls to stem the tide of illegal immigration while he lives in a godamn walled-city with effectively no immigration, legal or otherwise.

[RandoRock]

Good point. I also like how that hypocritical old virgin (the pope, not Hill-dog) chastises others for having the temerity to propose building walls to stem the tide of illegal immigration while he lives in a godamn walled-city with effectively no immigration, legal or otherwise.

People are always quick to point out that the Vatican has open borders so the wall doesn't count, yet they ignore the fact that it's only open for tourism. You can't just up and decide to settle in the Vatican but you visit. The Popes opinions on any wall, American or otherwise, is invalid unless that wall is being built to keep out tourists. Then he is free to criticize all he wants with out being a hypocrite. 

[jgiffin]

I got curious. So, at the risk of derailing this thread, here's a to link the wikipedia page listing countries by their ratio of immigrants.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_immigrant_population

I'll forgive you if you missed Vatican City. It's fucking fifth from the bottom. The US is, rather conspicuously, the first. HAH! That's laughable, mang!

[RandoRock]

The general public cannot be bothered to actually do the research, they'll just believe anything their respective political god spews fourth. If even half the people that went out and campaigned for all these causes actually took the time to read up on them then America might actually start moving in the right direction again.

[BikerDude]

The general public cannot be bothered to actually do the research, they'll just believe anything their respective political god spews fourth. If even half the people that went out and campaigned for all these causes actually took the time to read up on them then America might actually start moving in the right direction again.

They don't own guns.
So they don't care.
They aren't in their eyes "losing" any rights.
That's why IMO we gun owners need to be the ones addressing the issues.
Not people who don't know and don't care.

[BikerDude]

Good point. I also like how that hypocritical old virgin (the pope, not Hill-dog) chastises others for having the temerity to propose building walls to stem the tide of illegal immigration while he lives in a godamn walled-city with effectively no immigration, legal or otherwise.

People are always quick to point out that the Vatican has open borders so the wall doesn't count, yet they ignore the fact that it's only open for tourism. You can't just up and decide to settle in the Vatican but you visit. The Popes opinions on any wall, American or otherwise, is invalid unless that wall is being built to keep out tourists. Then he is free to criticize all he wants with out being a hypocrite. 

Perfect!
They should gather all the homeless and wretched from all over Europe and drop them off at the Vatican.
With tents and sleeping bags.
How long do you think it would take before the holy bouncers showed up?
And if not. Well. Problem solved.
Kudos to his Popishness.