The duality of Dude

[meekon5]

....Project Hate...and...Project Love

Sounds like some sixties anti-hero organisation like SMERSH.

[NiJoDude]

My theory on abiding is founded in Popeye The Sailors belief system. BTW, he was very dude like. Any who, I abide til I can't abide no more.

[delmiss]

Not sure where to go with that but if writing is a series of choices,
and the Coens chose this for the Dude then it was a conscious choice
man. And what were they saying there?

[BikerDude]

Not sure where to go with that but if writing is a series of choices,
and the Coens chose this for the Dude then it was a conscious choice
man. And what were they saying there?

Yeah that about does her. But it doesn't wrap her all up.
The point is that in the bio they chose for the Dude he is not the abiding kind.
He has extreme viewpoints. Or he at least supports them.
Maybe it's meant to show that the Dude changes with the changing times.
That he is a vessel to be filled with whatever is the prevailing views of the time and place.
But there it is.
He is the right guy for his time and place.
Is this a treatise on what the 60's were? A lot of big ideas that most people just followed as nothing more than a style?
Is the Dude the right man for this time because of a vacuous nature? His abiding?
Or is there some aspect of the Dudes nature that does not shift and stands like a rock in a raging stream?
Lotta in's and out's here.

[Masked Dude]

For me, and that's just, like, my opinion. the Dude starts off as being unrealistic. I have to admit that when I first watched the movie at the beginning I wasn't cheering or booing him. But then bad stuff happens to him, he copes the best way he can, and then he does what he feels he must. Then he lets it go because it'll be the 10th soon enough.

And that's pretty much one of the ways to be dudely. Sometimes life throws lemons, limes, oranges, and papayas at us. We can either get pissed off and yell at the damn citrus or we can enjoy it.

There's a quote that I'll paraphrase: It doesn't matter how many times you get kicked down, it's how many times you get back up.

[BikerDude]

For me, and that's just, like, my opinion. the Dude starts off as being unrealistic. I have to admit that when I first watched the movie at the beginning I wasn't cheering or booing him. But then bad stuff happens to him, he copes the best way he can, and then he does what he feels he must. Then he lets it go because it'll be the 10th soon enough.

And that's pretty much one of the ways to be dudely. Sometimes life throws lemons, limes, oranges, and papayas at us. We can either get pissed off and yell at the damn citrus or we can enjoy it.

There's a quote that I'll paraphrase: It doesn't matter how many times you get kicked down, it's how many times you get back up.

Well yeah but if the Dude just let it go and never went to the Big Lebowski none of the bad stuff would have happened.
But would that have been the correct course?
Should we let aggression stand man?
What is it that makes a man?
A pair of testicles or doing the right thing no matter the cost.
Obviously it's a balance. And where the line falls depends on whether you are a nihilist or Walter or the Dude or Donnie.
What does the flick preach. Donnie is the character that absolutely always lets aggression stand and he dies.
Smoky was a pacifist. Nobody fucks with the Jesus (but of course 8 year olds Dude).
In the end this is the conceit of the story for me. It's not every set in stone and most importantly shouldn't be.
It's a balance of principle and self interest. A never ending debate.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cyLdtG7KZvw

[Masked Dude]

Well yeah but if the Dude just let it go and never went to the Big Lebowski none of the bad stuff would have happened.
But would that have been the correct course?
...
What does the flick preach. Donnie is the character that absolutely always lets aggression stand and he dies.

The rational part of my brain tells me it's a movie. If he had just said, "You know what, I'm the Dude, life goes on, fuck it," then we wouldn't have a movie. We'd have a short YouTube video. So of course he had to do something.

In the real world, sometimes we do things that we feel we need to do. Others look at it and say it's not important, move on, don't bother. I had to use the phrase "it's the principle," because often even the person saying that realizes it's nothing major. Maybe the Dude wanted the Big Lebowski to own up to his wrongdoings? After all, if the Dude screwed up, he'd admit it (I'm guessing here; I'm not a Coen brother). But the Big Lebowski, being who he is, says no, it's your fault, you bum.

Donnie only died because he got caught up in this whole shebang. If it had just been resolved, Donnie might have died an old man with no overwhelming problems. Maybe he would've liked it that way. The reason I don't just say, OK, Donnie died because he never confronted anyone, is because Walter lives fine. I can't say never let the aggression stand because then we could argue that we should Walter-esque assholes all the time.

Just my $0.02, but I think Donnie was the character like we all have in our lives. He's overlooked and pushed aside. When he's gone, you realize you didn't appreciate it when you had it.

But again, it wouldn't be a good story if it was real life.

[BikerDude]

Well yeah but if the Dude just let it go and never went to the Big Lebowski none of the bad stuff would have happened.
But would that have been the correct course?
...
What does the flick preach. Donnie is the character that absolutely always lets aggression stand and he dies.

The rational part of my brain tells me it's a movie. If he had just said, "You know what, I'm the Dude, life goes on, fuck it," then we wouldn't have a movie. We'd have a short YouTube video. So of course he had to do something.

In the real world, sometimes we do things that we feel we need to do. Others look at it and say it's not important, move on, don't bother. I had to use the phrase "it's the principle," because often even the person saying that realizes it's nothing major. Maybe the Dude wanted the Big Lebowski to own up to his wrongdoings? After all, if the Dude screwed up, he'd admit it (I'm guessing here; I'm not a Coen brother). But the Big Lebowski, being who he is, says no, it's your fault, you bum.

Donnie only died because he got caught up in this whole shebang. If it had just been resolved, Donnie might have died an old man with no overwhelming problems. Maybe he would've liked it that way. The reason I don't just say, OK, Donnie died because he never confronted anyone, is because Walter lives fine. I can't say never let the aggression stand because then we could argue that we should Walter-esque assholes all the time.

Just my $0.02, but I think Donnie was the character like we all have in our lives. He's overlooked and pushed aside. When he's gone, you realize you didn't appreciate it when you had it.

But again, it wouldn't be a good story if it was real life.

Yeah it is just a movie.
But it is making some very interesting observations and there's a lot of in's and out's.
That's the point. So yeah the plot feeds these observations.

Yes Donnie did only die because he got caught up in the whole shebang. Which he had no hand in creating.
But he could have walked away. He could have urged the Dude to let it go and not confront the Big L.
He could have done a lot of things but in the end he was Donnie. He did nothing. And he was the character who died.
I don't think Walter provides a counter to the idea that Donnie died for simply going along it provides proof.
Walter did do fine. And the Dude was able to abide because Walter took on the nihilists.
Walter was a prick to Donnie who didn't deserve it. But also a prick to the nihilists who did.
For me one of the main questions that the movie explores is whether aggression is ever the right path.
And it shows just how complicated a question it is.
It was certainly correct in the case of the nihilists.
The Dude is a bridge between Walter and Donnie.
He is not incapable of aggression. He shows this several times in the show.
But generally he's chill. Part Walter and Part Donnie.

At the table in the kitchen, there were three bowls of porridge.  Goldilocks was hungry.  She tasted the porridge from the first bowl.
"This porridge is too hot!" she exclaimed.
So, she tasted the porridge from the second bowl.
"This porridge is too cold," she said
So, she tasted the last bowl of porridge.
"Ahhh, this porridge is just right," she said happily and she ate it all up.

[HnauHnakrapunt]

My mother (a catholic) used to terrify me (unintentionally I'm sure) with the words...goodnight, godbless and see you in the morning if we're spared.

Mine never used such an expression. Perhaps it's the fact that she practiced Zen together with Catholicism as a young person, though it was never like 'I'm gonna teach you the secrets of Buddhist monks'. Wanna know? Read yourself what you want to read. And find it on your own. If possible stay away from black magic of any kind, please.

I learned something about that 'if I stay alive' when I started to practice Brahms' Lullaby on the piano, and there was of course this line
'Morgen früh, wenn Gott will,
Wirst du wieder geweckt'
('you will be awake in the morning if God wants it' - softened in some English version to 'may thy slumber be blessed', which is definitely something different)
and I thought: WTF? I am gonna wake up like any other day before, do not play with me this way. I never prayed to survive the night. When I die, I die, but I won't spend my whole night thinking about it.

[HnauHnakrapunt]

Before you're a dude, you might have to go through some un-dudely stuff first

I would say with your first dude thought you may become even more undude for some time, trying to fix things. Your old attitude is still present and you cannot just throw it into a dustbin.