Naughty Israeli's

[DigitalBuddha]

If that land mattered so much to them, why did they do all but NOTHING with it for centuries?

Native Americans didn't really 'do anything with' the land for centuries. It doesn't mean you don't value something just because you haven't built a casino on it yet.

This is my concern, dude.......

You're missing the point; the Palestinians had no historic motivation or push to settle or rule the land of Israel UNTIL Israel became a nation 1948; a Jewish nation. Then, all of a sudden, like a bunch of drunken morons, they start claiming that it was "their land." Even as muslims, they have no claim of the land Israel is on. Jerusalem, as an example, is not even mentioned in the ko'ran.

They have no legitimate claim, no history of possessing the land, no legal right to attack and destroy Israel, no international recognition as a people in ownership of the land of Israel, and no background of establishing a government or society OF ANY KIND. Their claim is pure made up bullshit and fucking fairly stories!

The name "Palestinians" was applied to them by terror organizations and islamic groups in an attempt to make them sound like they are indigenous to the area of Palestine (the historic Holy Land) and belong there; i.e., Palestinians = Palestine, and Palestine = Palestinians. Only ignorant people believe it. It's nothing more than pure lies and propaganda.

"I - Origin and identity of the so-called Palestinians - Palestinians are the newest of all the peoples on the face of the Earth, and began to exist in a single day by a kind of supernatural phenomenon that is unique in the whole history of mankind, as it is witnessed by Walid Shoebat, a former PLO terrorist that acknowledged the lie he was fighting for and the truth he was fighting against..."

Dude, all they want to do is kill Jews...end of story.

The Indians were a real people or peoples for centuries in America; the so-called "Palestinians" are a fantasy construct of organizations such as the PLO, they didn't even exist as a recognized group until the middle of the 20th century and only as a slang term. They're Arabs, nothing more. They're not a legitimate people or ethic group with any history at all or any claim on the area THE TURKS called Palestine (a term, by the way, meaning "bad lands" or "trash dump" or "waste land.")

Palestine was all but deserted; as Mark Twain once said concerning the returning of Jews to the "promise land" while traveling through Palestine, he wrote "a land WITHOUT a people, for a people without a land." He was referring to the migration of Jews from all over the world beginning in Mark Twain's time to Palestine that was all but desolate and void, more or less, of even Arabs.

In other words, the Arabs (falsely called "Palestinians") under the rule of the Turkish/Ottoman Empire, didn't give a damn about the Land of Israel. Now that the Jews have it back, the Arabs, calling themselves "Palestinians" suddenly want it.

You really need to learn your history, dude.

[Boston Rockbury]

I'm not sure that geting all embroiled up in history is really the point. The Israelis are over the line in the West Bank. Whatever historical twist you put on it they have effectively annexed land against internationally recognised borders. People get uptight about that sort of thing whether they are called Pally-stinians Ay-rabs or whatever else.
The land-bone's connected to the rocket-bone.

[Caesar dude]

I'm not sure that geting all embroiled up in history is really the point.

If you don't look at the history then you will NEVER get the point!

The history is what has brought Israel and the Arabs to this. It started in 1948 the instant the state of Israel was formed/ The Arabs then attacked in 1967 and 1973.

I think Israel is entitled to defend itself in any way it chooses including pre-emptive strikes.

What would you have them do? Give up the land and go somewhere else?

[DigitalBuddha]

I'm not sure that geting all embroiled up in history is really the point.

If you don't look at the history then you will NEVER get the point!

The history is what has brought Israel and the Arabs to this. It started in 1948 the instant the state of Israel was formed/ The Arabs then attacked in 1967 and 1973.

I think Israel is entitled to defend itself in any way it chooses including pre-emptive strikes.

What would you have them do? Give up the land and go somewhere else?

"If you don't look at the history then you will NEVER get the point!" ...absolutely correct!

[Boston Rockbury]

I'm not sure that geting all embroiled up in history is really the point.

If you don't look at the history then you will NEVER get the point!

The history is what has brought Israel and the Arabs to this. It started in 1948 the instant the state of Israel was formed/ The Arabs then attacked in 1967 and 1973.

I think Israel is entitled to defend itself in any way it chooses including pre-emptive strikes.

What would you have them do? Give up the land and go somewhere else?

I'm not saying not to look at history, just that it's all too easy to become slaves to our own angle on history - just like the Catholics and Protestants did in Northern Ireland. People see history through the lens of their own resentments and fears whilst thinking that they are being objective. When both sides do this you are never going to get a solution. Living more in the present helped the Northern Irish communities see each other as people not so different from themselves. Palestinian Arabs are not at heart different from Israelis (in fact genetically they are almost identical).

[BikerDude]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_exodus

[DigitalBuddha]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1948_Palestinian_exodus

It's an interesting post in Wikipedia, but notice...

This article has multiple issues. Please help improve it or discuss these issues on the talk page.
This article's factual accuracy is disputed. (May 2011)
This article's introduction may be too long for its overall length. (May 2011)
The neutrality of this article is disputed. (May 2011)

And...

The neutrality of this article's title, subject matter, and/or the title's implications, is disputed. This is a dispute over the neutrality of viewpoints or other implications of the title, or the subject matter within its scope, rather than the actual facts stated. Please see the relevant discussion on the talk page. (November 2012)

And also notice that the "Palestinian exodus" "occurred when approximately 711,000 to 725,000 Palestinian exodus in Mandatory Palestine and the 1948 Arab-Israeli War"

In other words, the so-called "Palestinians" were running after trying to destroy the new state of Israel and were mostly fleeing after losing their war on Israel. When Israel was created, they, the "Palestinians" were offered FULL CITIZENSHIP and FULL FRANCHISE in the new country, (the one and ONLY democratic nation in that region) and turned it down in favor of war and violence. THEY TURNED DOWN A CHANCE TO JOIN A DEMOCRATIC NATION AS FULL CITIZENS IN FAVOR OF MUSLIM DICTATORSHIPS. Not very bright!

Many times civilians are forced to flee a location in the midst of war, especially one they are losing. The Israelis did not drive them out, they left after losing their war with Israel. It was a disaster for the Arabs nations who then horded them in "refuge' camps" using them as cannon fodder for decades and into the 21st century, as terrorists and human shields.

The terrorists that were trying to destroy Israel at it's birth have used that "exodus" nonsense as a convenient lie and propaganda trying to fool the world into believing that Israel merely "took the land and mercilessly drove the Palestinians out." Nothing could be further from the truth.

Notice...

The 1948 Palestinian exodus, known in Arabic as the Nakba (Arabic: an-Nakbah, lit. "disaster", "catastrophe", or "cataclysm"), occurred when approximately 711,000 to 725,000 Palestinian exodus in Mandatory Palestine and the 1948 Arab-Israeli War.

Also I would ask why didn't the so-called "Palestinians" make war on the Turks (Ottoman Empire) or the British when they ruled Palestine and the "Palestinians" were living their under their rule? Answer; because the Turks were not Jews, and even though disliked by the Arabs, neither were the British.

As soon as the JEWS legally took control of their ancient homeland by UN mandate (Israel was created by a democratic vote in the UN in 1948), the Palestinians began a war against Israel (the legal government) with the aid of other Arab nations such as Egypt and Syria. The "Palestinians" lost and fled...that is where the so-called "Palestinian exodus" came from. They were not arbitrarily, and for no legitimate reason, driven from Palestine.

As always; IMHO

[Boston Rockbury]

Sure dude just keep banging the same Israeli drum if you want, but it won't get the situation any nearer to a reconcilliation. We have to get past fear and recrimination to find peace with our neighbours.

[BikerDude]

1.There used to be a country called Palestine.
2. It was where Israel is now.
3. Palestinians (who don't live there any more) are pissed.

I rarely like simplicity but sometimes a nutshell holds a lot.

[DigitalBuddha]

1.There used to be a country called Palestine.

I rarely like simplicity but sometimes a nutshell holds a lot.

This dude would disagree...............

February 12, 2012
There Was Never a Country Called Palestine
By Jerrold L. Sobel

Please forget one of the great fallacies of our time: Israel did not steal Palestinian land.  It's not Palestinians' land; it's never been their land;
it will never be their land.  This land was given to the Jewish people...

There Was Never a Country Called Palestine - http://www.americanthinker.com/2012/02/there_was_never_a_country_called_palestine.html

This dude would disagree also................

One of the myths of our time is that Israel, before it was settled by the "alien" Jews and "stolen" from the Arabs as a result of "imperialist machinations," was an independent state called "Palestine" whose majority residents were Moslem "Palestinians". Unfortunately for those who would propagate such misinformation, the truth can be easily and historically seen.

The historical fact is that until the defeat of the Ottoman (Turkish) Empire in World War I, there was no geopolitical entity called "Palestine," no Arab nation ever set historical roots on this soil and no national claim was ever made to the territory by any national group other than the Jews.

"PALESTINE" - Never an Arab Country - http://www.cdn-friends-icej.ca/never_arab.html

1. Israel Rule (Biblical period)  1350 BC to 586 BC

2. Babylonian Conquest  587 BC to 538 BC 
3. Israel Autonomy (under Persian & Greco-Assyrian sovereignty)  538 BC to 168 BC 
4. Revolt of the Maccabees  168 BC to 143 BC 
5. Rule of the Hashmoneans & their successors  143 BC to 70 AD 
6. Jewish Autonomy (under Roman & Byzantine sovereignty)  70 AD to 637 AD 
7. Rule of Moslem Caliphs...

   Mecca 637 AD to 661 AD
   Umayyides 661 AD to 750 AD
   Abbaaside 750 AD to 870 AD
   Fatimides 969 AD to 1071 AD  637 AD to 1072 AD 

8. Seljukes Rule  1072 AD to 1096 AD 
9. Crusaders Ayyubids (in parts only) 1175 AD to 1291 AD  1099 AD to 1291 AD 
10. Mamelukes Rule  1291 AD to 1516 AD 
11. Ottomans (Turks)  1516 AD to 1918 AD 
12. British Mandate  1918 AD to 1948 AD 

13. Israel rule under democracy  1948 AD --- . 

[DigitalBuddha]

Sure dude just keep banging the same Israeli drum if you want, but it won't get the situation any nearer to a reconcilliation. We have to get past fear and recrimination to find peace with our neighbours.

What does that even mean? "Sure dude just keep banging the same Israeli drum if you want..." We are sympathizing here dude...with historic facts, referring to it as merely "banging the same Israeli drum" doesn't add any information or make a point.

[BikerDude]

LOL!
There was a area which some silly people called Palestine. (Is that OK?)
People lived on it. They don't now.
They are pissed.

[Boston Rockbury]

1.There used to be a country called Palestine.
2. It was where Israel is now.
3. Palestinians (who don't live there any more) are pissed.

I rarely like simplicity but sometimes a nutshell holds a lot.

So you're saying the land-bone IS connected to the rocket-bone, right?

[Boston Rockbury]

Sure dude just keep banging the same Israeli drum if you want, but it won't get the situation any nearer to a reconcilliation. We have to get past fear and recrimination to find peace with our neighbours.

What does that even mean? "Sure dude just keep banging the same Israeli drum if you want..." We are sympathizing here dude...with historic facts, referring to it as merely "banging the same Israeli drum" doesn't add any information or make a point.

It means that you seem to be flying in from a pretty heavy anti-arab angle dude. I aint got no beef with arabs or jews, just because I have an issue with some bits of Isreali government policy doesn't mean I'm antisemiotic or anything. I just don't see how we can increase the peace whilst we hold dominion over the Palestinian (as the old song goes).

[Zen Dog]

Pissed dude? Are you sure.Many of them are Muslims.