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Author Topic: Moving Dudeism Forwards  (Read 148779 times)

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Rev. Ed C

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Moving Dudeism Forwards
« on: August 13, 2011, 03:36:59 AM »
It's been a pretty enlightening week for me, what with my involvement in the UK leg of the Dudely Lama's docu-tour.  Been great to shoot the breeze about things with some likeminded fellas, including the DL himself.

However, I wonder if in light of all I've seen, heard and talked about this week, it's a great dawning of Dudeism starting to move forward.  It's found a starting point, it's jumped and it's making moves, but I'm worried about the whole thing stagnating near the beginning of this fantastical journey.

So, why no let's get the ball rolling on talking through some of what we think Dudeism needs to start focusing on in the future?

What am I blathering about?

Well, I'll try and keep it light for the first post, as I'm not usually one with the ways of brevity, so here are a few jumping off points for discussion:


1)  We need to start expanding the Dudeist canon. A lot of dudes, including myself, have been working on this, trying to broaden the horizons of Dudeism away from this pure Lebowskiist model.  I think one of the most harmful things for our movement is to be caught in this Lebowskiist image that's a) offputting to some, b) holds us back from bigger things and c) makes people quickly dismiss us as a joke or a movie cult.

Dudeism is inspired and realised through TBL, it's not about it.  It may be intrinsically there and part of it, but I think it's time for it to be downplayed a little compared to true Dudeism.  I'm not the only one who thinks so, and I've got some agreement from some more learned Dudes on this, so I think the time is now to get the ball a'rollin.


2)  The gender/race divide.  Now, as much as we know we're some to some great female dudes, that we're all for equality and egalitarian ways, and the like, it's generally seen from the outside as "phallocentric" and an all white-male club.

I think when coming away from Lebowskiism this will help.  The image we portray is very important to evolving our philosophies and broadening our base of members/followers/believers.

My own partner still isn't convinced, in spite of all I've told her about our female Dudes and the broader ethos we're into.  Although she can see what I'm saying and knows about the bigger picture, the image we have is quite offputting and unwelcoming to some, and we need to start evening that out before we alienate people who would otherwise be down with us.


3)  Apart from being a club for white males, it's seen to be a club for single white males.  The reality of it is, most of the Dudes I've met and spoken with, be they male or female of persuasion, are in relationships, have children and even grandchildren.  Yet, Dudeism, as it stands, covers no ground when it comes to bonding, apart from with friends.  Perhaps its time to start looking at more family and partner related sections of our ethos.  It's all in there somewhere, man, but most people can't find it, and that's another offputting thing.


4)  Finally, the slacker nature, as we know, isn't about being a jobless bum, or a workshy scrounger, but once again, that's how it seems to others.  The first article I wrote for the Dudespaper was about this very issue, that once again, most of us work and contribute, but the Lebowskiist fixation and image detracts from that.  People can't take seriously something that seems to work on a model doomed to failure.

We want a broad spectrum of people digging our ideas and benefitting from this.  We want to bring people on board, not push them away.  Yeah, we're irreverent and the whole idea of Dudeism is that it's a bit of a joke, but in the way that life is a joke and we can make light of serious things.  We need to instill that in our image rather than people laughing like it's only a joke and nothing more.


We've got a great thing here, guys, I think we just need to move it off the Lebowski springboard and propell it into the philosophical blue yonder.  The fact that the Dudeism documentary interviewed such a range of people who were down with Dudeism in principal but were put off by the image until we explained the broader aspects, and that Thomas and Olly specifically chose them for this reason, I think is the dawn of moving forwards.

Dudeism wants to get a'rollin, we all just need to start giving it a push.  Inclusive of Lebowski, yes.  All about Lebowski, no.  We need to start straightening this image before it traps us.  It's time to start talking about Dudeism not as a religion 'about The Big Lebowski', but as a whole.  Lebowskifests are what the Lebowski fantics have, Dudeism is for something else.

So, let's talk :)
« Last Edit: August 13, 2011, 11:10:12 AM by Rev. Ed C »
Large chunks of my Dudeist philosophies can be found in my Dudespaper column @
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SmokeytheBuddha

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Re: Moving Dudeism on
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2011, 06:20:52 AM »
Lotta cool strands here to keep in ol' duder's head, man.  :)

I've thought about these points you outline and especially like "Dudeism is inspired and realised through TBL, it's not about it."

That's one of the hardest things to get across to people. Human beings have a natural tendency to embrace the metaphor and not what the metaphor is pointing to. Like Buddhism is much more than Buddha, or Christianity is much more than Jesus. Even though both Buddha and Jesus say words to that effect, we still have people bowing before Buddha statues and crucifixes.

I'll mull this over some more, but I think the challenge we face here comes down to the paradox that opens the Tao te Ching:

The tao that can be told
is not the eternal Tao
The name that can be named
is not the eternal Name.

Your other points are excellent things to ponder as well. I'm particularly vexed by the whole race thing. I think we're making inroads with the gender thing, but race, I don't know.

Unfortunately, TBL, like most of the Coen Brothers' movies, focuses mainly on white male characters and their concerns. Still, they also speak to deeper universal issues as well. Today we're so polarized and segmented into our cozy demographic blocks that we often overlook in general these universal concerns that affect us all and get hung up on the things that divide us.

These are all just some rambling thoughts to help get things started. I don't have any large analysis or answers to post. However, with all the turmoil right now (London riots, austerity, wars, economic crises, etc.) I really do think the essential message of Dudeism is something people need (and deep down want) to hear. Like the sacred clowns and holy fools of old, I think we Dudeists are the ones to do that, but have to find ways to get that message across to them in ways that make them laugh, think, and experience something larger than themselves.

Not an easy thing to do but I think your post here is a great way to begin moving in that direction.

I'll look forward to seeing some more responses.
  
« Last Edit: August 13, 2011, 06:22:49 AM by SmokeytheBuddha »
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Rev. Ed C

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Re: Moving Dudeism on
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2011, 06:43:42 AM »
As usual, you and I seem to be in tandem here, AD :)

That's one of the hardest things to get across to people. Human beings have a natural tendency to embrace the metaphor and not what the metaphor is pointing to.

You'll have to watch out for my next article in a few weeks.  I've had it down for a while by ran it by Olly this week as a precursor to sending it in, finally.  It's call Mything the Point, and it's exactly about that, how people read the words exactly and miss the message that's in them.  The message in mythology is so often distorted by translations and a lack of personal poetry/insight/context when reading.

There's a lot to tackle, yeah, but I think it's a good time to start, what with there being a bit more of a trend amongst a lot of us to steer into something with more substance beyond the basic messages of the movie.

Glad to have you with us, as always :D
« Last Edit: August 14, 2011, 05:06:14 AM by Rev. Ed C »
Large chunks of my Dudeist philosophies can be found in my Dudespaper column @
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MotherDuderior

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Re: Moving Dudeism on
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2011, 07:27:11 AM »
New shit has come to enlighten me!

"There's a lot to tackle, yeah, but I think it's a good time to start, what with there being a bit more of a trend amongst a lot of us to steer into something with more substance beyond the basic messages of the movie."

Hell yeah. I know that I seem to take nothing (Nossing?) seriously, but Spirituality is very much lacking in our time and place. True Spirituality, to me, is not buying in to a money-grabbing, fear-mongering, ignorance inducing, inspiring hatred "belief".
It's being open to all that this wonderfully short life offers. Gutters and strikes and what have you, makes us better people.
As for the race/gender divide...I have always just considered people as, well people. I treat everyone the same (yes I am a cheeky besom!) we are all compeers (in the parlance that we know and love) dude.

I'm starting to lose my train of thought...dammit. ???
I wish my brain worked as well as it did when I was younger!

Rev. Ed C

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Re: Moving Dudeism on
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2011, 07:40:13 AM »
Yeah, Ma Duder, with race and gender, we're all equal as Dudes.  Dudeism, as I proposed in another article of mine, is the great leveller.  It's even more egalitarian than Sikhism or Buddhism.  We have no discrimination here, and yet...

From the outside people don't see that benefit, they just see some hairy white guy smoking ganja and a bunch of people trying to imitate him.  It clouds the real message of an egalitarian society under the banner of dudes, not labels like black, white, man, woman, straight, gay or even a yellow-bisexual-hermaphrodite.

I think, apart from being a broadening of the whole ethos, the most important thing to sort out is out PR 8)
Large chunks of my Dudeist philosophies can be found in my Dudespaper column @
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Landshark

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2011, 12:53:42 PM »
My question would be to what extent will we downplay TBL as part of Dudeism? Are you wanting us to cast off our robes, shave our facial hair (if any), and never touch a white russian again?

I do agree we need to expand the church. I think as priests we should consider how to take Dudeism from its present state as what some might call an e-religion and bring it in to the physical world. Something to consider would be recognition by the government as a religion. In the U.S. I believe we are required to have a congregation, a place of worship, and the congregation must contribute some amount of time to community service.

So to attain recognition we must first find a way to get people interested. I wouldn't think this step would be too hard, we have more ordained priests than most other religions do members. At this point in my ramblings I now see the importance of not making the religion about TBL. :)

cckeiser

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2011, 02:20:29 PM »
What's That Smell!? ???

Yo meekon5, cakebelly!...you smell something rotten here?
Do I detect the rancid odor of "Christianization" going on here?

WTF!?...expanding the Dudeist canon - move it - springboard - propel - evolving our philosophies - broadening our base of members/followers/believers.

Yo dudes...just feed it; keep the fuckin' Christians out, allow it to be organic and grow on it's own. 8)


« Last Edit: August 13, 2011, 06:07:01 PM by cckeiser »
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4weeddude

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #7 on: August 13, 2011, 02:55:01 PM »
YEAH I agree ..... this makes sence........ let it grow on it's own ......
What's That Smell!? ???

Yo meekon5, cakebelly!...you smell something rotten here?
Do I detect the rancid odor of "Christianization" going on here?

WTF!?...expanding the Dudeist canon - move it - springboard - propel - evolving our philosophies - broadening our base of members/followers/believers.

You dudes...just feed it; keep the fuckin' Christians out, allow it to be organic and grow on it's own. 8)



I have been knowen to par-take

Rev. Gary (revgms)

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #8 on: August 13, 2011, 06:40:16 PM »
And so the schism begins.duhn...duhn...dah

Just kidding, but really there tends to be two schools of thought here, that boil down to a question. How do you have definition with no structure. We will always get caught in the web that is the first verse of the Tao, as Smokey pointed out. But then I remembered my "Lazy man's Guide to Elightenment". When you remember it is only a game and the rules really don't matter, then go ahead and play the game.

It doesn't matter how we do it, as long as we remember it is only a game man.

We could build chapels, as long as we remember they are just cool props for the game, or an empty meadow could be a cool prop, no where anywhere it's all the same. Just moves in the game. It's not the ball, the lane or the pins that matter, it's the game.

CC's right, but Ed's ideas are how it grows organically, I share his enthusiasm and heed CC's cautions, and I roll, I roll a lot in my quiet little corner.

Landshark

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #9 on: August 13, 2011, 08:33:16 PM »
Looking at the VW commercial Olly did ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FYUD6vs0pg4 ) I have to wonder though how far is distancing ourselves too far. In the commercial we see he has a booth set up at a bowling ally trying to help others take it easy and he talks about how the religion and the dude are intertwined.

I guess what I am trying to say is would it be wrecking Olly's idea to distance ourselves from the movie.

I know in an earlier post I said I could see the importance of distancing ourselves. The idea of being a movie "cult" bothered me a bit. After seeing the commercial though It makes me think there should be some kind of middle ground.

I don't know man. Too many strands.

cckeiser

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #10 on: August 13, 2011, 11:47:04 PM »
fuckit dudes...lets go bowling. 8)
There are not Answers.....there are only Choices.

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Rev. Ed C

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2011, 02:19:22 AM »
Ok, some good points raised whilst I've been a'sleepin :)

First off, let me assure you, as I said, I'm not for dumping TBL, I just think it's not what it's all about, and we all know that.  No one thinks it's just TBL and that's that, but from the outside, that's what people see, and when people ask "What is Dudeism?" and someone says "It's about The Big Lebowski" it's a misrepresentation.

Secondly, there should be no one telling anyone what to do and how to be.  I have a beard that if shaved off could make about 6-10 Dudely facial wigs, that's who I am.  I just don't think we should say it's necessary to wear robes or grow beards or smoke dope, it's an option, like my long beard is to me, and my own style of clothing.  Dudes are some of the truest individuals out there (unless they're all trying to conform to copy The Dude in a way that might creep The Dude out if he met a gang of his own clones).

Afterall, The Dude is an individual first and foremost.  He digs the Stranger for his style, but how would he react if someone was wearing his exact clothing and trying to be him completely.  I think he'd not be so down with that kind of identity theft ;)  Besides, the official word on Jelly Sandals this week from the Dudely Lama was that they weren't that comfortable for him, each to his own man, and each to his own comfort.  Comfort yes, enforced discomfort for the sake of conforming, no.  I mean, I love wearing a bath robe at times, but I wouldn't wear one in the middle of summer :P

I'm not saying ditch anything apart from the single-minded Lebowskiist view we have from outside.

Thirdly, hold off on the lynch mob there, CC.  That's very undude to try and call my friends to run me out of town :P  Especially as I know Meekon is onside with me.  He may be infamously guarded against Christianity (which, by the way is not my bag, so let's leave them out of this and say no more about them, this is about Dudeism), but he's also very non-Lebowskiist, as far as I know.  It's a common issue that TBL speaks a lot, but it often speaks more to US culture than to us outside of it.  As Brits, Cakey, Meekon and myself are statistically less likely to get out of TBL what you guys in the US do.  I'm a massive Coens fan, I've used several of their other films in my articles, and my column for the Dudespaper's called Dude Simple, I'm all for Coenisms and Lebowsiisms to be used, but I think we need to paint it as more than that.

I don't think making things more like other religions is the way forward, we don't need to be conforming, but, let's look at something here.  You say no to Christian influence (beyond the dudely words and actions of Christ, I'm sure), but then why are we called a "Church"?  And why do we parody sacrament, and other Christian things.  I agree, leave Christianity alone, and let's put some of the parody away.  We don't want to turn into those Pastafarians, just parodying things to try and paint other people's beliefs as absurd.  We're the religion of abiding and tolerance.  Let them other do what they want, and if they do something we agree with, great, and if not, that's just their opinion, man ;)

Thirdly, yeah, I want this to evolve naturally and organically, but it needs discussion on how to progress, which is what this is (I hope).  We need to talk about things and toss ideas out there make this evolve.  Evolution requires catalysts and our biggest catalyst (apart from Olly Lama's first watching of TBL) is talking.  We're interconnected over the internet, our biggest asset to forming up as Dudeists.  Until I met Revs Meekon and Klaus in real life last year, it was all just talking, words and more words on a screen.  Then I met the Dudestock crowd the other month (Mother Dudirior, The Archdude of York and the whole gang), and the Dudely Lama and the Italian film-dudes last week.

I've talked Dudeism, face-to-face, real time, and that's a truly special thing.  I have a truly brilliant time shooting the breeze about all kinds of crap, as well as Dudeism itself.  And, you know what, you might think that the VW advert is an argument that ol' Olly Lama might not be on side with me on this, but you might be surprised.  Like I said, this discussion comes off the back of what I've seen and been a part of this week.  Dudeism was, is and always will be at one with Lebowski, and it's always going to have been realised through it, but there is more, we know there's more, but we need others to see it.

What we have here is a failure to publically represent.  PR fail, if you will :P

We've talked to sceptics this week and converted them with non-Lebowskian talk about what else we're about.  It's not a movie cult, they suddenly realise.  There's more to it than a bunch of white guys slacking off and shirking.  There's a real ethos to it that speaks to people and can work on a larger scale.

No one's trying to force anything here, I'm just trying to get people talking, and hells, it's worked.  If this is as far as we get in discussing this, I've already achieved :D  Any more discussion and movement on these points is all gravy (wavy or otherwise) from here on in.

Don't be afraid to tell me you think I'm full of shit, but also don't be afraid to agree and talk about this without making it into a schism or divide or an invasion of something that's not Dudeist.

I am A Dude, not The Dude.  To make Dudeism seem to everyone as all about Lebowski is like people thinking Judaism is all about Moses leading some slaves out of Egypt.  There's more to it than that.  Buddhism is more than reincarnation, Sikhism is more than just turbans and Rastafarianism's more than dreadlocks and ganja.

Keep talking guys, through all the strikes and gutters we're gonna hit in this thing, there's gonna be a score at the end and I don't expect it to be a perfect 300 :)
« Last Edit: August 14, 2011, 02:38:04 AM by Rev. Ed C »
Large chunks of my Dudeist philosophies can be found in my Dudespaper column @
http://dudespaper.com/section/columns/dude-simple/

Where are you Dude? Place your pin @ http://tinyurl.com/dudemap

cckeiser

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2011, 06:59:16 PM »
Sorry dude, but the Christian stench gets my Walter up. 8)

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cckeiser

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2011, 07:07:38 PM »
Now here is a good article on what you are talking about

http://dudespaper.com/on-and-off-the-road.html/

...and I quote you here:

In life, no one has any kind of GPS. Global Positioning for the Soul. Unheard of. Although, it is what religions generally try to impart, with their holy texts, and mythology, and codes of practice and clergy, and whathaveyou. Dudeism takes a more relaxed attitude to life?s roads. We don?t try and steer you down any one in particular, we just encourage you not to run as you go or worry about what the road signs say. At the end of our road isn?t necessarily heaven, hell or nirvana; it?s happiness, and there?s no one way to get there. In fact, it?s a different road for each one of us, that?s the great thing about the diversity in our community, and the richness that brings to us all.
By Rev. Ed Churchman
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Rev. Ed C

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Re: Moving Dudeism Forwards
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2011, 04:35:09 AM »
Ow, touche :)

Well, that's how you know I'm on side with the natural flow and evolution.  But, as you also know from the articles I write, I'm about shooting ideas out there that do move to the wider grounds of Dudeism's lush and verdant garden.

To counter quote from a more recent publication, by a couple of wiser fellas than myself:

Quote
(Bruce) Lee said: "Always be yourself, express yourself, have faith in yourself, do not go out and look for a successful personality and duplicate it."
Never one for pretense, the Dude was always at ease with himself and had obviously spent much of his life avoiding the square community's ideas of success.

That's from the Abide Guide.

This whole statement, to me, includes the ironic thing of trying to be THE Dude in order to capitalise on his Independence.  Conforming to not-conform is a complete oxymoron.  There's a diversity in our community, but when you boil things down to TBL and insist people wear robes and burn jays, the diversity goes and conformity rears its bearded head :)

I don't want people to stop learning from and quote TBL, but I want a bit more focus added on all the other cool stuff we've been doing.  I'm not trying to force anything here, I'm just dropping a pebble in the river and seeing what ripples it creates in this one thread.  If I was forcing anything I'd be making demands and saying this is how it should be, in the old Fascist motif.

The thing is, to most outside of our circle, we're all walking down one road, as a massive group, doing the same stuff.  Don't we want people to think they can come in here and walk around and wander and do what-have-you without feeling alienated or ostracised for being Dudes who aren't Lebowskiist.  I think some of the more extreme Lebowskiist practices are fine to visit us, but their real home is at Lebowskifests.  It's all a bit of fun, and we know that, but I think it's not winning us many converts who can't see the Dudes through THE Dude.

If you're down with my ideas from the DP, I'd hope you were down with my ideas about having this discussion.  I'm not tryin' ta scam anyone here ;)
« Last Edit: August 15, 2011, 04:52:11 AM by Rev. Ed C »
Large chunks of my Dudeist philosophies can be found in my Dudespaper column @
http://dudespaper.com/section/columns/dude-simple/

Where are you Dude? Place your pin @ http://tinyurl.com/dudemap

 

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Dudeist Monk Kim

April 11, 2016, 11:00:44 PM
Oh hey.. neat feature, for direct conversations in the time and place.

RandoRock

April 11, 2016, 05:00:59 AM
Why does nobody use the Big Blather Box?
 

RustyMarmot

January 28, 2016, 03:31:30 PM
?Finish each day and be done with it. You have done what you could. Some blunders and absurdities no doubt crept in; forget them as soon as you can. Tomorrow is a new day. You shall begin it serenely and with too high a spirit to be encumbered with your old nonsense.? Ralph Waldo Emerson

Rev. Ron

December 28, 2015, 09:33:28 AM
I nominate the late, great Meadowlark Lemon of the Harlem Globetrotters. "My destiny was to make people happy". He missed just one game in 24 years, playing in over 100 countries. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/meadowlark-lemon-dead_568152d9e4b014efe0d8ac6d

Hippiejohn

November 23, 2015, 04:36:11 PM
How fucking awesome is this Walter :)
 

Rev Nicholas Rehfeldt

November 17, 2015, 06:11:16 PM
.....I've never noticed this before, has it always been here?
 

Brother Seamus

August 20, 2015, 08:39:53 AM
A "shout box" sounds very undude, more Walter-ish to be honest...

Bradypus

July 27, 2015, 02:11:15 AM
Oh gosh these messages will last here for months e_e

Bradypus

July 17, 2015, 02:57:37 PM
PS: sorry for precedent shout, in my country it's allowed ^^

Bradypus

July 17, 2015, 12:36:07 PM
Icy and pear perfumed beer... sweet sticky marocco hash... and 93? F / reasons to slack.
Something tells me it's gonna be a good night.
 

DigitalBuddha

May 17, 2015, 11:29:54 PM
fucking great weekend slacking!
 

Patrico

April 25, 2015, 04:17:55 AM
Good morning Dudes!   :D
 

Chaplain K

April 14, 2015, 11:24:24 PM
Finishing off a gin and tonic... life is pretty darn good!
 

DigitalBuddha

April 13, 2015, 12:36:17 AM
Slacking off in dude like laziness all day. It doesn't get any better.
 

MrEazy

April 10, 2015, 06:30:43 AM
hi guys
 

MrEazy

April 10, 2015, 06:30:43 AM
hi guys
 

MrEazy

April 07, 2015, 08:20:51 AM
Argh Suggest me some war movies to watch :D
 

MrEazy

April 07, 2015, 08:06:45 AM
hey how can i post links ? Do i need something ?
 

martin

April 05, 2015, 06:01:57 AM
nothing lasts forever dude
 

Pei Mei

April 03, 2015, 04:57:28 PM
How do you stay dude on a hangover?
 

martin

February 08, 2015, 04:10:05 AM
dude, thats fucked up, let the trees abide
 

DigitalBuddha

January 22, 2015, 11:29:48 AM
The fuckers are cutting down my favorite shade tree by the fence to my backyard!! This aggression will stand man!!!

Rev Larry

January 18, 2015, 07:24:44 AM
Norman Greenbaum's "Spirit In The Sky" should be played in all Dude "Services," weddings, funerals, talks, etc
Rev Larry

Rev Larry

January 17, 2015, 02:44:46 PM
I nominate Betty White to "historical dudes (living). " She is just turning 93 and rocks like Gibralter !

Rev Larry

January 17, 2015, 06:21:03 AM
Where and how does a dude (ordained) ad an avatar ? Thanks Rev Larry :D

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